| Author | Message | |||
     Mark Anson Frequent User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 20 Registered: 11-2004 |
Hi All, I have just found a Mk1 Shadow for sale at a good price. This vehicle is quite a few miles away so I have not been to see it yet. The seller told me it has a fault on the autobox. You cannot select any gears with the column shift, he says its a relay that is behind the headlight. When he reaches under the car he can select the gears manually! Can anyone help with this problem? I need to know what it is before I buy. I am a mechanic but have no experience of electrically operated actuators etc and wonder if this is a little more that the seller is letting on. Any help and advice would be greatly appreciated. Many thanks Mark Anson UK  | |||
| Bill Coburn Grand Master Username: bill_coburn Post Number: 338 Registered: 4-2003 |
Mark can you get the chassis number please? It is on a plate on the bulkhead left hand side near the wiper motor. It will read SRH xxxx. | |||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 302 Registered: 9-2004 |
Mark,the first thing to check is the thermal cut out switch it is in the fuse box, Press the red button on the housing to reset,it may be this causing the prob but there may be another prob if it keeps doing the same after being set. Keep us all informed if this does not work. but not Paddy or Jock DARE of Beaumaris. | |||
| John Dare Grand Master Username: jgdare Post Number: 170 Registered: 12-2004 |
Thank you Mark. Your Chassis/VIN. as requested by Bill C, will allow further advice which might be of assistance. I have access to auto. trans. rebuilders who have rebuilt many 3 and 4 speed Shadow transmissions and I feel sure that they will be able to analyse the problem which may be external anyway. For your information, I have a completely rebuilt actuator for the 3 speed GM T-400 trans., but again, would need your vehicle ID to determine its suitability or otherwise, if needed. Be VERY careful with this proposed purchase and look well BEYOND the transmission "fault", whatever IT may be. PLEASE seek and arrange a comprehensive inspection by qualified and experienced "R-R" specialists, since the "cheapest" Shadow invariably becomes the most EXPENSIVE!. Regards, John. | |||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 303 Registered: 9-2004 |
Paddy Jock John Dare of Beaumaris Start at the primary part first. No need to hijack the thread.} (Message edited by david_gore on February 09, 2005) | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 406 Registered: 4-2003 |
Mark, Patrick's suggestion re the thermal cutout on the fuseboard is the first starting point. If this does not fix the problem then some detective work with a continuity tester/multimeter and the workshop manual will be needed to find the problem. the actuators are usually very reliable however the wiring to the actuator is a known problem area, especially on early model Shadows, due to corrosion. Replacement sections for the wiring harness were available approx 12 months ago however Bill C. may also know of an after-market supplier who can make replacement looms from your original providing it is relatively intact. Whilst Mr Dare's pre-occupation with professional mechanics is well known to regular users of this forum; there are other contributors who will help you with specific advice based on their own knowledge and experience which may obviate the need to pay unnecessary expenses if the problem may be identified by you. Just go as far as you can within the limits of your ability and then hand the job to a professional if appropriate - at least you may save the cost of the professional doing the tests you have already done and documented. I suggest you should search this site for the copious amounts of posted information on buying a used Shadow if you haven't already done so. | |||
| Mark Anson Frequent User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 21 Registered: 11-2004 |
Thank you for your input so far. Does the reset button for this gear leaver protect any other circuits? If they are not working it would tell me the power has been switched off to the gear selector. I would still need to find the fault but I could ask the seller if say the clock has stopped working. I don't want the seller to fix the fault as the price of the car will shoot up. I am capable of most repairs...usually when the car is in front of me. I was hoping somebody has had a similar experience with thier gear selector, and there fore reassuring me it was a cheap fix. I have just sent a text to the seller asking for the chassis number so should have this soon. I had a chat with him yesterday and he said he drove the car fine for four years. One day he put it into drive and there was a BLUE puff of smoke near the front of the car near the headlights then the gear selector no longer worked. He told me you can move the leaver underneath and manually put it in drive and the car drives OK. Any thoughts? I take on board your warnings of more troubles in the future. This car has just three owners from new, lots of history and paperwork. Even on a mint car you could have problems...many thanks though for your advice. Cheers Mark | |||
| Mark Anson Frequent User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 22 Registered: 11-2004 |
Hi, Chassis number is SRH20910 Can somebody give me anymore info about this car on the chassis number given? Thanks Mark | |||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 304 Registered: 9-2004 |
Hi Mark,the reset button will reset two of the three thermal switches. One is the central locking. Two is the gear range actuator. The third is the headlamp saftey circut, now this one is a automatic thermal reset type. If my memmory is correct just one fault will only throw one circut switch leaving the other one working. When either of them stop working you have to wait for them to cool down before the reset button will reset the thrown switch. I cannot think what relay is up by the headlight that could cause the puff of smoke that would effect the cut out switch unless the loom as David states runs round there and has some horrors. You could ask if the headlights all work as they should. Can go into testing of the actuator later if you find this does not work after the purchase. Regarding the chassis no from my trade notes it looks as if the car was a 1974 build very late in the year October onwards. Like the three owner part, what colour etc. has it good S/history. What part of the country has it been in? Don't rush. | |||
| John Dare Grand Master Username: jgdare Post Number: 171 Registered: 12-2004 |
Thank you Mark. I am not sure what you mean when you ask for "more info." Perhaps you could clarify this at which time Bill C might be able to further assist now that you have supplied the VIN as he reqested on 9/2. Contrary to the foregoing assertion, I do not have a "pre-occupation" with professional mechanics, but for the most part, reserve a measure of RESPECT, as I do for most reputable professionals possessed of documented qualifications from a recognized institute or authority, irrespective of their area of expertise. I have ABUNDANT respect for those who graciously offer, often via clubs/forums, their reliable, field/shop floor "tested" technical advice on an absolutely FREE ("gratis/pro bono" etc) basis, not seeking to insult or demean their RESPECTED standing, by challenging, disputing, debating and opposing anything and everything that they offer in good faith, primarily for OUR collective benefit, devoid of any agenda for personal aggrandisement. If one responded, "NO.. thats not right!", on almost EACH and EVERY occasion that our physician offered a diagnosis or prognosis, he/she would probably be compelled to write a referral for a psychiatrist. It is often said that a house is the largest material purchase that one makes, and since we typically engage architects or professional builders to inspect a house, it follows that we would (or should) do likewise for a motor car, particularly one that is 20+ years of age. The basic decision is whether you engage the recognized trained and experienced "players" or the spectators beyond the boundaries and borders, the opinions (and pronouncements) of the latter too often being of a quality that is inversely proportional to the quantity. I therefore urge that you contact the RREC and attempt to locate a professional R-R technician, who, being independent (VERIFY!) of the seller, should be able to protect your interests for a modest fee. Good Luck. John | |||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 305 Registered: 9-2004 |
Another rambling verbose post from Jock Paddy John Dare of BEAUMARIS - see Swammelstein Forum for explanation. Mark has not even bought the car yet! As David has stated read the many postings regarding purchase of a Shadow. I am sure he does not need copious amounts of waffle. Paddy jock by your own admission you have a prime example of a car not to buy ie noisy diff. Sludge carbon build up in sump. Many gauges and instruments to keep a look out for the many problems that a dog of a Shadow can have when groaning and straining under slight load. (Message edited by david_gore on February 10, 2005) | |||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 306 Registered: 9-2004 |
Paddy Jock Dare BEAUMARIS Victoria. As confirmed that you live by yourself with lodgers that use your computer Re Swammelstein posting. Please let us know the chassis no of your Shadow for the records and the co-owners if relevant to confirm that you are a genuine owner/enthusiast. (Message edited by david_gore on February 10, 2005) (Message edited by david_gore on February 10, 2005) | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 407 Registered: 4-2003 |
Hi Mark, Have just re-read all the posts and realised this is a UK car and accordingly will not be in our Australian records. If you eventually purchase the car; the factory build records will be available from Hunt House [see RREC website for contact details]. I am not aware of the actuator wiring going anywhere near the front of the car but there could be relays there for the headlights - I would get the high/low beam functioning checked; if they do not work - it is possible the relay has fused and caused the smoke. The check for the thermal cutout would be the central locking system; if this is not functioning due to a short circuit, this will trip out the transmission cut-out switch causing the selection problem. In the extreme case and in accordance with Murphy's Laws; it is possible the expensive cut-out switch failed to protect a cheap relay!! In any event, the idea of getting under the car to manually operate the gear selector before proceeding horrifies me purely on the safety aspects involved. (Message edited by david_gore on February 10, 2005) | |||
| adny pinto Unregistered guest Posted From: 81.144.153.147 |
Mark, I see you are in the UK, as I am too. I suggest that you read the postings on this site and www.swammelstein.nl and also get the car inspected by someone who knows the models intricacies. If you are present when the inspection is done, you may pick-up some advice that you can use when you work on the car yourself. I would also recommend that you join the RREC. Where abouts in the UK are you? Perhaps I could suggest someone? andy | |||
| Robert Wort Prolific User Username: robert_wort Post Number: 98 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hi Mark, I've kept a bit of a distance away from this as there are far more qualified people on this thread than I. Regarding your prospective Shadow. it sounds a little like buyer beware, but if you have the time and patience, maybe you can purchase this car and slowly restore it to its former glory despite all of the warning signs. It seems to me that you are already enraptured by the car and while there is every indication to me to say "Run a Mile!", I think that you obviously love the car and want to fix it. To this end I give you my full support. I personally don't want ANY Rolls-Royce ending up at the recyclers. Just a few years ago, people rescued vehicles that seemed totally unsaveable (is there such a word?). Just the same, with a lot of loving care, they were restored to their former glory. You would do yourself and the marque a great service if you took on such a venture. Of course, I'm not saying for one moment that this car is in such a bad state. But if you don't purchase it and if no-one purchases it, then it may just end up in the graveyard which I think would be the unthinkable. Sorry for the rambling but I'm nearly finished. I agree with Adny above and I think you should definitely follow Adny's advice. If your finances are a bit stretched (like most of us), then maybe you should seriously think of an alternative. But if you have the patience (which by your input, I think you have), then I would say, "give it a go!" But get it for the lowest price you can and turn it into a project. Good luck Mark. One way or another, I'm sure you will get the car you really desire and make the right decision. | |||
| Mark Anson Frequent User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 23 Registered: 11-2004 |
This post is more like a "soap opera" Many thanks for the ramblings and Verbosing (is there such a word?) you are all very entertaining....just wondering if there is an icon for "group hug" so we can all be friends.  The story so far....spoke to seller (laying it on thick) that the cost of repairs could be up to a £1000 with the brake work too. He has agreed to drop the price to £2000...this has me worried as he did not really put up much of a fight! It could be me but I would at least try and haggle first. Looking at your replies I think it could just be an electrical fault. He assures me the car will drive (with the manual assisting of the actuator). but I still have a nagging doubt. Unfortunately I do not have the luxury of being able to send a RR mechanic to check the car (or the money). I am quite a good judge usually with most vehicles myself when I see them but as I have only seen this via email pictures I just needed some reassurance the gear problem is not a major one. Many thanks Mark | |||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 309 Registered: 9-2004 |
Hi Mark, as you are in the UK you could get the AA or RAC to do an inspection report. This will cover all aspects mech and body etc. Keep smiling  | |||
| Mark Anson Frequent User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 24 Registered: 11-2004 |
Hi Patrick, Thats fine if you have £180 to spare. I can do the check myself, I am a time served mechanic but the car is over two hundred miles away. I was hoping someone may have had a similar problem with there gear selector just to put my mind at rest before I go to see the car. If people told me it was a very expensive job to fix it, I would not even bother going to view the car. It looks like it could be a wiring loom/fuse fault which I am presuming is not that bad. Many thanks for everybody's help. I will be in touch and let you know the outcome. Cheers Mark | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 408 Registered: 4-2003 |
Good Luck Mark and hope you can find time/afford to go and inspect the car - I suspect the problems with the car may be more extensive especially with regards to corrosion as it is probable at least the previous owner has undertaken minimal maintenance - the fact that they have not repaired an obvious fault in the transmission selector prior to sale suggests the overall presentation of the car is such that it is not worth the cost. | |||
| Mark Anson Frequent User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 27 Registered: 11-2004 |
Just spoke to the owner and he is now having problems starting it as it has been stood for some months. I am borrowing my recovery truck from work and will be setting off later this morning to see the car, and even buy it if its OK. Will keep you informed and send pics if I can Thanks for all your advice, warnings and concerns. Cheers Mark | |||
| Mark Anson Frequent User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 28 Registered: 11-2004 |
UPDATE: The deal is done! I now own a Shadow one. On arrival the poor car looked a bit too far gone to even consider rescuing but on much closer inspection I could see a little gem waiting to be brought back to life....I also saw the seller struggling in the boot with the battery. As I walked up the drive he looked a little sheepish (embarrassed). He had told me on the phone the car runs great and ticks over like a sewing machine. What he had omitted to tell me was that was 12 months ago! The battery was dead so he tried jump starting it, he says the engine turned over slowly but did not fire. He then went and bought a brand new battery and had just fitted it. He now does not have any ignition (gen) or oil lights when you turn the key. The door, interior and headlights work OK but its dead on the key. Does anybody have an idea what could have caused it. Would fitting the battery the wrong way around blow anything? It was right when I arrived but who knows what he had been doing before I got there. So anyway...because of the electrical fault I offered him £1500 and he took it. This car has every MOT cert confirming a genuine 88,000 miles. The service book is stamped up (last couple missed) and the log book shows three owners. The interior was not as bad as I thought and with a little polish will look good. The paint and body is a different story, this needs repairs to both rear wheel-arches and back panel. The roof is heavily rusted but is all fixable. Oh and it has 4 newish tyres and a brand new battery  So all in all I am very pleased with my purchase...just need some time to work on it now! I m painting the Bentley Mk VI this week so I will have to leave it until then. Would appreciate any help on the lack of dash lights. I have done a quick check of the (weird) fuses (visual and not with electrical tester yet) and they all appear OK. I pressed the reset button on the fuse panel but this seemed OK too. Many thanks Mark | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 411 Registered: 4-2003 |
Mark, Problem is almost certainly a blown Bulgin 10Amp 1AG fuse in position 11 or 12 on the fuse board under the driver's kneepad - the current draw when trying to start the car with low voltage will always blow these fuses. If the fuses are OK [test with continuity tester not visually]; it is also possible for the fuse holder contacts on the underside of the board to be loose/corroded so this should be a check item as a precautionary measure anyway. The 1AG fuses should be available from any auto electrical supplier and certainly at car club "swap meets" - Crewe parts prices for these are best left unsaid. | |||
| Mark Anson Frequent User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 29 Registered: 11-2004 |
Many thanks David. I am trying to find someone who stocks the fuses locally at the moment. Just temporarily could I use 10amp wire soldered across the outside of a blown glass fuse (I have two in a bag) The other option is to slide a modern 10amp (Toyota) fuse across the terminals using the dead fuse to keep the tension on the blade. If you understand what I mean? I wont get a chance to look at it until tomorrow so will let you know. Cheers Mark | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 413 Registered: 4-2003 |
Yes, you can use this temporary measure; blown fuses have also been reclaimed by use a Dremel Mototool to drill out the soldered connections in the end cap, inserting new fuse wire and resoldering. The fact that we can now buy 1AG fuses from a national carparts supplier [Super-Cheap] in packs for less than $4 put a stop to this. I would check your local MG/Austin/Morris vintage car specialists as they also used these fuses in the 1950/1960 era. | |||
| Mark Anson Prolific User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 31 Registered: 11-2004 |
Hi All, No luck...the fuses are all OK. There is no power at all at these fuses. There is power going to the clock and seatbelt warning lamp, door side lights, hazards and headlamps. Everything else is dead. Does the car have a main inline fuse say to the starter or alternator? This could have blown, or the feed wire that I presume comes from the starter solenoid has burnt out or broken. I have not jacked the car up yet as I have my Mk VI to sort out first. Any thoughts greatly appreciated. Cheers Mark | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 415 Registered: 4-2003 |
Mark, Could you please email me using the "Contact" link on the LHS of the page, confirm your chassis number as SRH 20910 and give me your email address - if so I can send you a full set of wiring diagrams for your car in Adobe PDF format provided you can handle attachments up to 10Mb | |||
| Mark Anson Prolific User Username: bentleybloke Post Number: 33 Registered: 11-2004 |
Hi David, Sorry but I'm being a bit "dim"...cant find contact link so here are my details: Yes chassis is SRH 20910 My email add is address removed by Moderator Many thanks I really appreciate it. Cheers Mark (Message edited by david_gore on February 17, 2005) | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 418 Registered: 4-2003 |
Hi Mark, No problems and you should have the information when you read this - have also included what information I have on the radio/tape player wiring in the hope it might help your other "headache"! | |||
| David Howard Unregistered guest Posted From: 82.110.149.93 |
Dear Sirs,I have a 1973 Shadow SRH14936 the hazard warning lights have just stopped working,the normal indicators work fine,fuse is ok and I can hear the relay in the dash click when I operate the hazard switch,I have a poor resolution CD wiring diagram but it is virtually useless.From the parts list it looks like the car has only one flasher unit for both indicators and hazard warning lights is this correct can anybody help me? thanks (Message approved by david_gore) | |||
| Richard Treacy Grand Master Username: richard_treacy Post Number: 1049 Registered: 4-2003 |
The hazard warning system has a separate flasher, fuse and relay. It is independent from the indicators, and works with the ignition turned off.  Higher Resolution to Download in PDF:
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| David Howard Unregistered guest Posted From: user-7775.l2.c2.dsl.pol.co.uk |
Richard Thanks all now becomes clear,just one thing do you know where this flasher unit is located on the car thanks again David (Message approved by david_gore) |
