| Author | Message | ||
     Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 1867 Registered: 5-2012 |
Hi Folks I've been able to confirm that the ACV/Sphere O ring has definitely blown and causing a hydraulic leak on my 74 SY1 (SRX18501). The accumulator in question is the one to the rear of the engine. Does anyone know if I can remove this without having to remove the front accumulator first? Geoff | ||
| Paul Yorke Grand Master Username: paul_yorke Post Number: 1957 Registered: 6-2006 |
Unfortunately not. Joy  | ||
| Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 1868 Registered: 5-2012 |
Thanks for the info Paul. | ||
| Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 1869 Registered: 5-2012 |
Is it ok to switch the position of the accumulators? The only reason I can think for not doing so is the hydraulic pipe unions will need to be re-seated. However this would apply anyway if I were fitting recon units (unit = acv and sphere). The reason I ask is this same acv/sphere started leaking 4 years ago. I could see nothing wrong with the machined surfaces at that time, but it is strange the same O-ring has blown again. I'm thinking if I put it on the front then I won't have to remove both accumulators again in 4 years time, just the front one. Geoff | ||
| Paul Yorke Grand Master Username: paul_yorke Post Number: 1958 Registered: 6-2006 |
No reason they can't be swapped. What method of tightening them did you use? | ||
| gordon le feuvre Prolific User Username: triumph Post Number: 221 Registered: 7-2012 |
Pretty unusual, as Paul says how are you tightening? Both the service centre's at both Crewe and London used to just exchange acv/sphere assemblies from their own hydraulic overhaul shops. The tecs.on the shop floor would give in faulty unit and take another re-worked one, so no problem exchanging position of units. Wouldn't it have been good to have these valves somewhere else, can't think of how many hours I spent struggling. When the pump to acv pipe changed from flexible to rigid, I had to personal modify about 45 cars, both 3 and 4 speed boxes as different kits! Also, compliant cars just make access harder. | ||
| Paul Yorke Grand Master Username: paul_yorke Post Number: 1959 Registered: 6-2006 |
"Wouldn't it have been good to have these valves somewhere else" Except moving the No1 to the o.s. on Shadow II's | ||
| richard george yeaman Grand Master Username: richyrich Post Number: 879 Registered: 4-2012 |
To all, Given the lack of space in the engine compartment where would be a suitable site for these accumulators and spheres to be relocated, My suggestion would be on the nearside inner guard where the server dryer and the fuel weakener filter is, Where would you fit them. Richard. | ||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 1654 Registered: 9-2004 |
Richard, big problem with that is the engine movement. RR do not like high pressure flex hose's. Citroen had coiled steel pipe so no probs with flexible high pressure hose's | ||
| richard george yeaman Grand Master Username: richyrich Post Number: 880 Registered: 4-2012 |
Thank you Patrick, but having said that my understanding of Citroen was that they used a belt driven pump instead of cam driven pumps buried in their bowels. The reason for my question was to see what alternatives the Cohort could come up with,. Richard. | ||
| Paul Yorke Grand Master Username: paul_yorke Post Number: 1960 Registered: 6-2006 |
RR do use flex pipes though! On the accumulators. Would not be worth moving them even if you could find the room  . | ||
| Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 1870 Registered: 5-2012 |
Thanks for your replies. Re: What method of tightening them did you use? I marked the relative positions of the acv and sphere with a marker pen. I then held the sphere in my left hand, down by my side, and used a copper mallet to shock the acv free of the sphere. Once it had loosened I unscrewed the sphere by hand. I then lubricated the new O-ring with some RR363 and very carefully hand tightened the acv and sphere back together again, making sure the O-ring had not become displaced. Finally, I held the sphere and tapped the acv with the copper mallet until the marker pen lines aligned. I figured that maybe a previous owner had not tightened the acv/sphere fully so I only used the marker pen lines as a guide. In the event it appears they were correct - it was tight. Geoff | ||
| h_kelly Prolific User Username: h_kelly Post Number: 239 Registered: 3-2012 |
Geoff, don't take this the wrong way but any chance o ring was put on upside down? . I swapped over a accumulator earlier this year thanks to your help, I did notice the o ring could only fit one way. | ||
| Paul Yorke Grand Master Username: paul_yorke Post Number: 1961 Registered: 6-2006 |
Geoff, good. Yes a copper mallet until solid and then a few more taps. It is not possible to over tighten the valve if you are holding the sphere against the ground with your hand. I've never had one leak using this method but tight until I can not stop it spinning is what I was taught. | ||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 1655 Registered: 9-2004 |
Yes Paul they do, the flex hoses don't like the heat and engine movement of the RR, can let go with total burn outs. I have never used any type of mallet to remove or refit a sphere and done many in my time. Maybe the acv has some damage due to the shock, within the alignment of the threads. BTW I use a blunt chisel used at the correct angle with a hammer. | ||
| Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 1871 Registered: 5-2012 |
Hubert I used a standard EPDM O-ring. I measured it to make absolutely sure it was the correct size. What was the shape of the O-ring you fitted? I thought the standard round cross section was the correct one. I am aware that some O-rings are square e.g. brake caliper gallery seals, but I was sure the acv/sphere O-ring was round. i.e. could be put in either way. Don't worry about me taking things the wrong way. I am only too happy to take advice, especially if it means I won't be having to do this job again in a few years time. Geoff | ||
| h_kelly Prolific User Username: h_kelly Post Number: 240 Registered: 3-2012 |
Geoff, the ring that came off the acv /accumulator had 2 definite sides, one round side, one flat side, ie a cross section would look like a D shape. Now I may be completely wrong and the shape may be a result of the torque between acv / accumulator over a period of time, however if this is the case it's odd (in my opinion) as the ring would have gone from a O shaped to a D shaped ring (cross section) Thus if the ring is "D shaped" it may indicate it's part specific (ie flat side to one part and round side to other part) Geoff, if the above is correct I can't tell you right now which side goes where,but I can take apart an old valve and accumulator over weekend and report back?. | ||
| richard george yeaman Grand Master Username: richyrich Post Number: 881 Registered: 4-2012 |
Hi Geoff I done this job earlier this year and bought the O ring of Flying Spares To the best of my memory it was square in section, Hope this helps. Richard | ||
| Paul Yorke Grand Master Username: paul_yorke Post Number: 1962 Registered: 6-2006 |
I would say spirit ones are square section but the shadow ones are round. The groove is in the accumulator and is probably semi circular. The accumulator valve face is flat. This would give the section you're thinking of Hubert. But pretty sure they are round to begin with and with a much bigger section than you would think. | ||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 1656 Registered: 9-2004 |
Yep Spirit ones are square. pix:  Shadow is round with the from memory semi circular is on the valve face [fit O ring] and sphere is seated when tightened up. It may be just needing to be tightened a little more first worth a try before you start! | ||
| richard george yeaman Grand Master Username: richyrich Post Number: 882 Registered: 4-2012 |
Paul thank you for enlightenment, as I have done this job on my Shadow using proper O ring from Flying spares so it must have been circular, I have also replaced both brake spheres and both gas springs on my Bentley Turbo R, and they were definitely square and then remember that I am in my dotage. | ||
| Paul Yorke Grand Master Username: paul_yorke Post Number: 1963 Registered: 6-2006 |
At least you have an excuse Richard!! LOL |
