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Peter Toet
Yet to post message
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 1
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Friday, 23 January, 2015 - 06:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I have recently acquired TA93 and am in the process of getting it running reliably. It had 3131 miles recorded ( believed genuine given it's history). I have dismantled and reconditioned the fuel tank and Autovac system. Many items were frozen through lack of use. I have rectified broken lines on the Bijur system and it appears to be spotting the garage floor in the correct places. I have now put around 60 miles on the vehicle and it is responding to the TLC. I need to replace some very old tyres, etc and increase my radius of test runs. Anyone out there recall this vehicle when owned by Bob Skillen/thereafter/ previous? I have known the vehicle since 1976 and it has descended a very slippery slope in condition since then. Peter
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richard george yeaman
Prolific User
Username: richyrich

Post Number: 253
Registered: 4-2012
Posted on Wednesday, 28 January, 2015 - 10:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Peter this is a shot in the dark reply to your post first of all welcome to the forum. Last week January 22nd I was in a place in Kent called Ghost Motor Works Ltd collecting a car that I had bought in one of the buildings that is used to store cars there was a Phantom 11 I asked a few questions out of interest and the owner said he was looking after it for an Italian friend. The name of the Gentleman that owns Ghost Motor Works is Mr Charles Baseley E-Mail enquiries@ghostmotors.co.uk he might be able to help you locate some parts.

Richard.
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Peter Toet
New User
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 2
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Thursday, 29 January, 2015 - 11:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello Richard, Thanks for the welcome to the Forum. I shall contact Ghost Motors as I need a few items and they may be abe to help. Peter
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Peter Toet
Experienced User
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 12
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Friday, 26 June, 2015 - 08:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

am awaiting advice on a replacement Lucas P100S headlamp lens. MeanwhileI have increased the original mileage from 3131 to 3420. The vehicle is very rattle free and I am taking it very easy. I have not had the Motor over 50 mph at this stage and am exercising the left leg frequently on the Bijur to get the lines working. Here is a pic of the rear upholstery for anyone interested. Best Regards, Peter Toet. 93  TA rear upholstery
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richard george yeaman
Grand Master
Username: richyrich

Post Number: 326
Registered: 4-2012
Posted on Friday, 26 June, 2015 - 10:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Peter Everything looks great a real credit to you keep the wheels rolling.

Richard.
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Geoff Wootton
Grand Master
Username: dounraey

Post Number: 793
Registered: 5-2012
Posted on Friday, 26 June, 2015 - 11:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Peter

It's always interesting to see photos of these cars. As Richard say's, a real credit to you for keeping the wheels rolling.

Geoff
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Chris Browne
Prolific User
Username: chrisb

Post Number: 216
Registered: 2-2010
Posted on Saturday, 27 June, 2015 - 03:44 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello Peter,

I have been reading your posts about 93TA with interest. I have been compiling a photographic database of Phantom II's for many years and I have , as yet, not seen a photograph of 93TA. I currently have photographs of 1,021 different Phantom II's but not your car. Would it be possible for you to post a couple of photographs of the exterior of your car so I can add them to the database?

Thanks and kind regards,

Chris Browne
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Robert Noel Reddington
Prolific User
Username: bob_uk

Post Number: 187
Registered: 5-2015
Posted on Saturday, 27 June, 2015 - 04:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

In bygone days leather was for the chauffeur and cloth for the rich owners.
Other way round now luxury cars with cloth are harder to sell.

This car is absolutely lovely. I hope that only minimal restoration is done.

A car is only original once.

If were my car I would make it reliable and use it as daily driver. The P2 is maybe a better car for daily use than a P3.
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Peter Toet
Experienced User
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 14
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Saturday, 27 June, 2015 - 11:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello all, Thanks for the encouragement. here is a pic of 93TA with the roof slid back into the body. P11 Thrupp and Maberly Limousine De Ville 93TA

93TA with De Ville roof in place
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Brian Vogel
Grand Master
Username: guyslp

Post Number: 1423
Registered: 6-2009
Posted on Saturday, 27 June, 2015 - 12:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Peter,

Is the upholstery in the passenger compartment original? I ask only because it appears to be in such good condition in all the photos, and I wouldn't expect that after all this time.

I find it beyond profoundly sad that this car likely covered less than 39 miles per year for the first 80 years of its life!! You've already covered just short of 3 years worth of its previous yearly mileage just during the recommissioning!!

Though I can't conceive of using a P-III as a daily driver, I certainly hope that she'll be seeing far more miles per year than she's ever seen before once you're comfortable with her functional state!!

Brian, who'd go broke trying to drive a P-III as a daily driver even at the low [when compared to almost all of the rest of the world] fuel prices in the USA
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Chris Browne
Prolific User
Username: chrisb

Post Number: 217
Registered: 2-2010
Posted on Saturday, 27 June, 2015 - 06:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello Peter,

Many thanks for posting the photographs. That's another one I can cross off my list! Wonderful car, by the way.

Kind regards,

Chris
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Peter Toet
Experienced User
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 15
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Sunday, 28 June, 2015 - 06:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello all, especially Brian, The upholstery in the rear is not original. 93TA was featured in a PRAECLARVM article in about 1982, when Bob Skillen wrote about getting the car from Percy Markam's museum in Perth in 1976, and restoring the car. The front leather is original but has been recoloured. I have attached a few pics, one of which is when it was for sale in the UK from Dale and Stepsons around 1965. ( water transfer sticker is still on the windscreen). I have also included a pic which I took of 93TA in Nov 1976 at Kalorama in Victoria. The car was fabulously original then and I can only surmise that Bob changed the car because he thought that he was getting professional work done. (I cannot bring myself to say restored as the changes were very, very poorly executed and the materials sub-standard). No criticism whatsoever of Bob is implied or intended, he was dudded by shonky upholsterers. He was a terrific Rolls-Royce supporter and a true friend of mine. Best Regards, Peter Toet



P11 93TA for sale in UK circa 1965

P11 93TA Original at Kalorama Victoria Nov 76
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Brian Vogel
Grand Master
Username: guyslp

Post Number: 1427
Registered: 6-2009
Posted on Monday, 29 June, 2015 - 12:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Peter,

I love the car in its current two-tone color scheme. Not that it wasn't attractive in that dark blue, but I think it looks so much more visually interesting, with certain of its body features highlighted, in the cream/yellow and black. I can imagine this car in any number of two-tone configurations.

I've now seen quite a few pre-war cars, and had the opportunity to ride in quite a few of them as well during a RROC-US Phantom I Society tour that was held just over the mountain from me several years ago. I don't recall prints being used with any frequency as the primary upholstery fabric, and that's why I asked. Of course, one could order virtually anything one wanted as far as the coachbuilders were concerned, so it wouldn't have surprised me to learn this might have been original. One can never say never with regard to how these cars were decked out. Some very unusual tastes were occasionally indulged.

Brian
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Robert Noel Reddington
Prolific User
Username: bob_uk

Post Number: 198
Registered: 5-2015
Posted on Monday, 29 June, 2015 - 03:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Before WW 2 RR only made rolling chassis.
The owner would then chose a coach builder. The design of which was totally out of RR control.

It was not uncommon for Phantoms to be purchased used and then rebody in a more desirable body. Because the original owners tastes were unusual. A common problem was designs that were overweight.

Pre 1931 Bentleys also suffered the same way. A few had heavy limousine bodys taken off and Le Mans touring type bodys fitted. Many racing Bentleys aren't original.

I saw a W O Bentley 4 seat tourer a couple of years ago. Originally it had been a Limousine. In the late 40s it had been re bodied with Weyman type construction. I reckon the car weighed 1750kg. 4.5 litre.

A guy in Swindon goes all over the world buying old Bentley parts which he builds into rolling chassis. The engines are remanufactured units. He then finds a customer and gets a body built to customers tastes. Mega money though. G H Day Ltd.
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Peter Toet
Experienced User
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 16
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Tuesday, 30 June, 2015 - 05:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi all , especially Brian...I also like the two tone colour combination. It was because Bob liked the Movie "The Yellow Rolls-Royce." ..I feel a twinge of guilt about possibly unfairly critising people in my last post(Restoration Services not Owners) as the effects of the changes are very positive. I have a few "on the road" comparative upper end cars from both sides of the Atlantic and I am enjoying getting my friends P11 back in service. I am including a few additional pics of the car for anyone interested. Best Regards, Peter Toet



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Robert Noel Reddington
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Username: bob_uk

Post Number: 212
Registered: 5-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 01 July, 2015 - 09:00 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Notice how plain the chauffeur's leather is. The trim in this car is very period and correct. The chauffeur would check oil levels etc and get oily hence the leather

This is a very nice example of an old car with patina. Its OK to touch up patina because the touch up becomes part of the patina.

I would love to have this car as a daily driver.

I am on my way with a container to steal it and smuggle it back to England.
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Peter Toet
Experienced User
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 17
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 01 July, 2015 - 09:14 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello Robert, You will need a 40 foot container
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Randy Roberson
Grand Master
Username: wascator

Post Number: 471
Registered: 5-2009
Posted on Thursday, 02 July, 2015 - 12:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Beautiful Car, thanks for sharing!
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Peter Toet
Experienced User
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 18
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Friday, 03 July, 2015 - 05:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello all....a few more pics of P11 93TA. One is of the Instrument Panel and I love how the timber grain mirrors from the centre. The other is a general view of the interior front. If I can get a third pic in, it is of the speedo which now has almost 3,500 miles recorded.

Best Regards, Peter Toet mirrored  real timber grain

93TA general interior front view

Speedometer a few months ago
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Brian Vogel
Grand Master
Username: guyslp

Post Number: 1450
Registered: 6-2009
Posted on Friday, 03 July, 2015 - 11:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Peter,

Thanks for the additional photos.

This brings me to a more general question: What was the thinking/philosophy behind the roof design on a sedanca de ville?

It always seemed peculiar to me that the passengers were locked in a closed compartment (particularly in hot weather, yes I know the windows open) while the driver could get full exposure to the open air (and sky) at will.

I don't think I've ever seen a "combination sedanca and landaulette" but prior to the age of the convertible, and when you wanted a formal car, this would have been my ideal configuration.

Brian
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Geoff Wootton
Grand Master
Username: dounraey

Post Number: 802
Registered: 5-2012
Posted on Saturday, 04 July, 2015 - 12:42 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Peter

Great photos. It's always good to be able to look at these amazing cars. It is one of the reasons I like Jeanne Eve's thread on the Centenary Alpine Trial (yes, I know they are Ghosts):

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/30/14188.html

I particularly like the "through the windscreen" shot of TA 93.

Geoff
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Robert Noel Reddington
Prolific User
Username: bob_uk

Post Number: 236
Registered: 5-2015
Posted on Saturday, 04 July, 2015 - 04:15 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Every photo just gets better and better.
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Peter Toet
Experienced User
Username: peterpackard

Post Number: 19
Registered: 1-2015
Posted on Saturday, 04 July, 2015 - 03:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello all, thanks for the encouragement. For Brian....I'm not certain of the subtle ( if any) differences between a Sedanca and Limousine De Ville...However, with 93TA ( a Limousine De Ville), the front windscreen is able to be tilted upwards almost to the horizontal, whilst the passenger division window may be wound down to give the rear seat and occasional (folding) seat passengers a full exposure to whatever draught is passing through the front of the drivers compartment. It works very well as even 100F ( 38C) drives are very comfortable indeed for driver and passengers alike. P11 93TA  head-on in 2015

P11 93TA Quirky fishtail exhaust outlet , similar to British bikes of the era
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christopher carnley
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 86.182.237.218
Posted on Saturday, 04 July, 2015 - 06:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

The veneer looks like English or European walnut, cut out of a large crotch in the tree. The blonde timbers were very "in" during this period.
Any modern substitute would be the American Black Walnut, used on most of the post war (11) cars.

(Message approved by david_gore)
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Randy Roberson
Grand Master
Username: wascator

Post Number: 481
Registered: 5-2009
Posted on Saturday, 04 July, 2015 - 10:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

As for the reasoning for the body designs, look back to the horse-drawn coaches which preceded them.
Some coaches seated the coachmen out front and outside whilst the passengers were sheltered from the weather.
Also recall England is blessed with mild summer weather which made temperature less an issue.
The Brougham is one of my favorite coaches. It has an interesting provenance.
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Jonas TRACHSEL
Frequent User
Username: jonas_trachsel

Post Number: 64
Registered: 2-2005
Posted on Tuesday, 14 July, 2015 - 03:27 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Brian
I try to upload a picture of 60WJ, a Barker "Sedancalette", a body configuration that you say you never have seen. This car is frequently seen at RREC meetings here in Switzerland.
Jonas
Phantom II with Barker "Sedancalette"-body
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Brian Vogel
Grand Master
Username: guyslp

Post Number: 1504
Registered: 6-2009
Posted on Tuesday, 14 July, 2015 - 04:17 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Jonas,

Thanks much. This is the first I've ever seen in photographs (or at all).

Brian
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Paul Yorke
Grand Master
Username: paul_yorke

Post Number: 1415
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Tuesday, 05 January, 2016 - 11:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

It was to keep the driver behaving himself. . . any misdemeanours and the owners would order him to open the roof and screen when it was cold a rainy.
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Robert Noel Reddington
Grand Master
Username: bob_uk

Post Number: 832
Registered: 5-2015
Posted on Saturday, 09 January, 2016 - 07:04 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Lovely. Nice colour. Fish tail unusual

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