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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 985
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 08:27:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Does anyone have a source for the Lucas two prong charging plugs that insert into the dash? I need several for purposes of conveniently trickle charging the battery. Need one for each vehicle. They are the same plug that is at the end of the inspection torch. FS has them at a high cost. Any alternatives?

.
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Robert J. Sprauer
Frequent User
Username: wraithman

Post Number: 85
Registered: 11-2017
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 08:49:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Christian, In the prosound/audio business we use a connector called a "Banana plug". Some are tandem, meaning they are molded 3/4 on center and others are single and commonly found online. I have plenty here but no car to see if it fits. Maybe you can ship one of the cars to me and I will report back to you. Cheers!
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Robert J. Sprauer
Frequent User
Username: wraithman

Post Number: 86
Registered: 11-2017
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 08:50:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banana_connector
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 986
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 09:52:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Robert...
That is an excellent idea. I will measure the diameters of the two prongs. On those for RR/B they are two different sizes (one larger than the other) so that the dual plug can only be inserted one way. Others for other applications (Moss Motors has them for MG and Triumph) are the same size (both are the smaller size) so can be inserted improperly (reversed polarity).

.
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Jim Walters
Prolific User
Username: jim_walters

Post Number: 212
Registered: 1-2014
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 10:55:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

https://www.completeautomobilist.com/products/960p-plug-for-dashboard-socket-unequal-pin

SRH8505 SRC18015 SRE22493 NAC-05370
www.bristolmotors.com
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 988
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 11:19:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Jim...
Bingo! Just what I wanted and while pricey, these are at least in the bracket of what I had expected. THANKS!
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Robert J. Sprauer
Frequent User
Username: wraithman

Post Number: 87
Registered: 11-2017
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 11:22:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Jim Nailed it.
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 114
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 12:13:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I seem to recall that the ones on the RR, although different sizes from each other, are thicker than shown. Shall I just measure the pins on the inspection lamp of my SCII to be sure?
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 1263
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 13:23:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Okay I am totally bewildered. It there a female port on either Spirits or Camargues for the banana and if so where is it?
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 989
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 13:23:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David...
Measure to confirm, but I am quite certain that dimensions will be as stated by Jim's link.
The same plug fits all of my RR/B chassis from Phantom I, Phantom II, all the small horsepower prewar RR and Derby Bentley, all EPW Dawn, Cloud, Silver Wraith, Bentleys, and the MPW (Shadow Coupe) as I recall.
Can't remember if the SZ cars have the dash plug (or is it in the boot?), but if so, undoubtedly the same.
The plug with two smaller ends also "works" but the ends need to be splayed open to get a tight fit into the dash socket and can be inserted incorrectly. Why "same size prongs" was thought to be a good idea is baffling.
Thanks again to Jim!!
A valued and appreciated contributor to this forum.

.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 990
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 13:26:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vladimir...
We were writing at the same time.
My recollection is that it is in the boot area somewhere. Cannot recall. I'm an EPW and pre-war guy mostly. Others will know.
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Glen Poolen
Prolific User
Username: wgipps

Post Number: 129
Registered: 3-2018
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 13:35:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

well im lost - where are these holes/adapters on a Series 1 Shadow?
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 116
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 14:28:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Dimensions plug measured were:

Centres: 13.67mm (0.538")
Small Pin 3 - 3.4mm (0.1185 - 0.1345" - Pin split opened side)
Large Pin 3.43 - 3.91mm (0.1350 - 0.1540" Pin split opened side)

So yes and no.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 991
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 14:28:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Glen...

boot charging socket

This is for the very early Shadows. Not sure about later in the series.

.
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 117
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 14:38:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I don't know if this is an original plug or not.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 992
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 14:47:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David...
Those from Complete Automobilist are aftermarket and may or may not fit properly and the specifications given may or may not be accurate. The only discrepancy with your data is the "on center" distance. Your pin measurements fit those given at the website.

All I can say is that the several plugs that I have were all sourced 30-40 years ago and were OEM and they are all interchangeable with every chassis that I have, even the plug that has the same sized smaller diameter pins. If the aftermarket ones are the wrong size, they won't work on any chassis and you would have expected they would have realized that by now. Tomorrow I will try to remember to measure one of mine.

.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 993
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 14:52:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David...
We were writing at the same time. The OEM plugs I have all look like the photo at the cited website. While yours does not, the design of the plug is not the issue, but rather the size of the pins and the on center locations. Several of my chassis have the "inspection torch" but honestly I have never used one and have never even looked at one closely. You have provoked my curiosity. I currently have the Cloud I at home and think that there is a torch in the boot. I will check tomorrow and report.

.
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 118
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 15:00:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I wait with bated breath Christian on your investigation. If mine is wrong it will just be yet another action to add to the "sometime in the future" list.
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Glen Poolen
Prolific User
Username: wgipps

Post Number: 130
Registered: 3-2018
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 15:11:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Well there you go. Thank you Christian.
I do have one.



Now if i understand what im reading here, i can get a plug to fit this socket and connect it to a trickle charger. I have a solar trickle charger that seems to work well.
Am i on the right track?
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 994
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 15:20:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Glen...
Yes. That's it. As noted in the manual page, it is a convenient way to plug in a trickle or maintenance charger.
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Glen Poolen
Prolific User
Username: wgipps

Post Number: 131
Registered: 3-2018
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 15:24:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Lucas part number CAB185 - there is mention of the 2 different size plugs but i dont see it on the pics of this part.
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Glen Poolen
Prolific User
Username: wgipps

Post Number: 132
Registered: 3-2018
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 16:48:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

One thing that MAY be worth looking at as an interim - i see in some pics that someone may have expanded the connector using a flat blade screwdriver so that the thinner connection expands out to touch the fatter plug. Perhaps, just a thought.
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michael vass
Grand Master
Username: mikebentleyturbo2

Post Number: 518
Registered: 7-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 20:01:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi all
so how is this plug polarised ,i.e. whats to stop you accidentally plugging the charger in the wrong way?
Mike
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Glen Poolen
Prolific User
Username: wgipps

Post Number: 133
Registered: 3-2018
Posted on Wednesday, 28 November, 2018 - 20:07:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Michael - theres a fat and thin side to the plug. It will only fit in 1 way.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 995
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 06:11:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Michael...
See photo showing different sized pins.

Battery Charging Plug

Putting a small dot of "white out" or colored paint on one side of the plug (i.e. the side that will be at the top as you insert it) is a secondary way to alert you to proper orientation.
If the question is "which terminal is (+) and which is (-)" the female port mounted in the dash veneer is marked for proper polarity. Following this guidance, it is up to the operator to attach the plug to the output wires of the charger accordingly.

.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 996
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 06:25:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Glen...
Regarding Lucas CAB185...that is the "other" plug used on "other" British cars that has equal sized pins. No point is modifying the wrong part when the correct part is available. Just found this link if you want the CAB185:
http://www.retroclassiccarparts.com/lucas-style-2-pin-dash-plug-cab185

same sized pins

.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 997
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 08:36:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Here is what I found:

dash port for charging plug & inspection lamp

inspectiion lamp silver cloud

Measurements:
small pin is .13" (3.3mm) (website: 3.18mm)
large pin is .16" (4.1mm) (website: 3.81mm)
"on center" distance is .52" (13.3mm) (website: 12.5mm)
.
The website dimensions for the pins are compatible with these measurements however the "on center" dimension is not, although close.
I suspect that someone has simply made a measurement error although it is also possible that the repro plugs are an incorrect remanufacture as the .8mm (.031") on center discrepancy (if accurately reported) while minimal, is possibly sufficient to constitute a "no go".

.
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Glen Poolen
Prolific User
Username: wgipps

Post Number: 134
Registered: 3-2018
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 09:50:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Christian - totally agree (its not the correct part) i simply mentioned it to perhaps give some more intrepid internet researchers a bit of a starting point.
Aside from that, i was wondering where the correct ones were available - then i read back.
Jim had posted the correct socket. Thanks Christian.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 999
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 10:09:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Glen...
Even the "correct" plug offered by Complete Automobilist (link kindly provided by Jim) remains to be verified as 100% fitting. Although off by just a bit in the pin "on center" dimension, I suspect that it will still work effectively if not perfectly for dimensional reasons that I will explain later as time allows. Sooner or later I will also probably email the vendor to verify the measurements quoted for accuracy. Eventually...

.
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 119
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 10:32:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I found the full Lucas Catalogue on the web:

Thanks to the MGA Guru

http://mgaguru.com/mgtech/books/pdf/L400e_sl.pdf

The original part numbers are shown for the plugs.
Regards, David
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 120
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 10:34:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thanks Christian,
Looks as though my plug is wrong, which would explain why it has never fitted snugly.
Regards.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 1001
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 10:50:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David...
That catalogue is an excellent reference. Proper plug is on page 9 and #304919. The equal size pin plug is #545025.
As to your plug, it corresponds to the specs that I found on mine as well so I believe is proper. I suspect that to get it to fit more snugly, you only need to splay one or both of the pins apart the slightest bit. They were clearly designed to be adjustable for fit. Try and see. Just the slightest amount.

.
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 121
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 10:55:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Which now leads us to this site which has the same plug a little cheaper:

https://www.s-v-c.co.uk/product/lucas-pin-plugs/payment-options/returns/
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 122
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 11:00:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thanks Christian, we were both composing at the same time. I've downloaded all Lucas parts catalogue sections now and rolled them into a single PDF. Maybe a dropbox or similar could be used to host catalogues and web links to various parts that could be made available to interested users. Of course something similar hosted here would be excellent.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 1002
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 11:24:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

P.S. When I took my measurements of "on center" dimension, I checked both the plug and also the dash socket so am sure that our measurements are correct rather than those posted at the two UK company links which likely use the same supplier given that the descriptions are precisely identical. I suspect that someone along the line simply measured incorrectly for purposes of the text rather than the plugs being remanufactured to improper dimensions. "Buying and trying" will settle the issue. Any volunteers?

.
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 123
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 11:29:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Yes I think you are right about the supplier dimensions Christian. I've just noticed one price with VAT the other without. They are exactly the same price, which means almost certainly the same source of supply. I too am sure the pin dimensions are likely manufactured correctly.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 1003
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Thursday, 29 November, 2018 - 12:10:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I need ten of them. One for each car when in storage, so I guess that I am that volunteer!
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 1006
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Friday, 30 November, 2018 - 07:33:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Email sent to vendor. Awaiting reply...
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Norman Geeson
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 81.99.138.38
Posted on Friday, 30 November, 2018 - 03:49:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

There seems to be some confusion regarding the pin centres on these dash plugs.

The pin centres are 0.515 inch (+ /- 3 thou

(Message approved by david_gore)
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 1007
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Friday, 30 November, 2018 - 09:42:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thank you, Norman...
Third confirmation that the vendor's website data is in error @ .492" (12.5mm)
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 1009
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Friday, 30 November, 2018 - 19:57:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Jheesh...
Talk abut not getting a straight answer to what I thought was a simple question! On the other hand, maybe I am not as articulate as I would like to be.
Here is the email exchange:

Question:
Sirs... I need several of the unequal pin charging plugs (your stock #960P) and am concerned about the dimensions cited in the listing text. While the pin diameters correspond within tolerance to those measured in the application vehicle (both the dash socket and the plug at end of inspection torch lamp) the “on center” distance between the two plugs does not correlate. Close, but off by about 1mm. Would it be possible to get one from stock and recheck the measurement? Thank you if you will do that.

Answer:
The exact measurement between the pins at the base closest to the body of the plug is 9.36mm, this is between the pin, not centres.

Follow up Question:
We really need to know the “on center” dimension...that is...from the center of the larger pin to the center of the smaller pin (or vice versa)...center to center. Thanks.

Oh well...at least I tried! We'll see wnat happens!

.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 1011
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Friday, 30 November, 2018 - 20:45:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Prompt reply from vendor:
"Centre’s are 13mm"

So...looks like we are good to go.
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Norman Geeson
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 81.99.138.38
Posted on Friday, 30 November, 2018 - 20:25:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Christian

You posted:-

Follow up Question:
We really need to know the “on center” dimension...that is...from the center of the larger pin to the center of the smaller pin (or vice versa)...center to center. Thanks.

Unless I have misunderstood your request, I answered this request and gave this centre to centre dimension as 0.515 inch +/-3.

Incidentally this was not measured but taken straight off the R-R drawing.

(Message approved by david_gore)
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David Balfour
Prolific User
Username: sidchrome

Post Number: 124
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Friday, 30 November, 2018 - 23:09:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

You know what Christian?

That Norman Geeson is a good man!

That's fantastic Norman that you even had a drawing. I've seen you pop up before with a high value response to some query or other.

Keep up the good work!
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 1012
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Saturday, 01 December, 2018 - 06:31:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David...
Yes, I too am an admirer of Norman Geeson. He is absolutely the best! The EPW Guru for sure.

...but Norman...you did in fact misunderstand my question. The issue was not the actual dimension which both David Balfour and I had measured as being about 13mm, but rather the apparent "wrong" specification provided by the vendor's website as being 12.5mm which while "close" was clearly not correct and there would be no point in ordering parts that either do not fit or only "sort-of" fit. I, for one, needed confirmation that the website specifications were incorrect rather than the reproduction parts having been made incorrectly. The email correspondence eventually confirmed that the repro parts are likely proper and that only the listing text needs to be adjusted. I also admit that I was perhaps a bit hasty in jumping on the vendor's initial reply. Forgive my impatience as simply being my nature.

.

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