| Author | Message | |||
     Robert Wort Grand Master Username: robert_wort Post Number: 274 Registered: 12-2004 |
Nubar Gulbenkian was the richest man in the world in the '40s and '50's but rich though he may have been, he certainly had no taste. Below are some pictures of his abominable Silver Wraith (Hooper body on Chassis No. WVA 16). Whatever drugs he was using at the time must have given him an awfully bad trip. Somehow, he must have had some of this drug left, apparently the designers of 100 EX and 101 EX used the same stuff and came up with the same hideous result for the 21st. Century.   | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 573 Registered: 4-2003 |
I can recall of some other coachbuilders' efforts from this era that also would not be considered as their finest creations. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder and we should appreciate this fact when forming our opinions as there will always be others who do not agree with our opinion. The front "spats" have got me intrigued about how much steering lock was available for manoeuvring the vehicle especially when parking however that may have been the long-suffering chauffeur's problem. | |||
| Jim.Cowin. Unregistered guest Posted From: 203.173.31.230 |
I'll agree gentlemen. Someone really got stuck into this one with the ugly stick! (Message approved by david_gore) | |||
| John Shostrom Experienced User Username: silvawraith2 Post Number: 36 Registered: 4-2005 |
Yes, it does seem that the designers at Goodwood were heavily influenced by the Gulbenkian Silver Wraith. I just viewed 101EX at a showing here last week, and although in my opinion the car looks rather heavy and far from graceful, I cannot help but think that a more traditional RR grille would help things considerably. As an aside, many years ago the late Arthur Rippey had Pantechnicon -- the name given the Gulbenkian Silver Wraith -- and several of us were given a chance to drive it round the parking lot. Nimble it was not, and the overall impression reminded me of what it must be like to dock the QE2. | |||
| Robert Wort Grand Master Username: robert_wort Post Number: 275 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hello all, A bit naughty of me, I know and I take David's point, but at least it started some discussion. One of the reasons why Rolls-Royce were always hard to design bodies for, is because of the grille. But muck around with it and you get disaster. Get it right and you have a masterpiece. Messrs Rolls-Royce had great things in mind for the future of their motorcar 100 years ago and had great insight when borrowing a design from the Pantheon. It has made the Rolls-Royce singularly the most distinctive marque in the world. if we accept what they have done with 101EX, then we could well see the gradual disappearance of the grille altogether and Rolls-Royce will become just another car. Don't believe me? Look at what Volkswagen has done to the Bentley. They have replaced it's beautiful grill with a barbeque device and now it has lost it's distintive quality. It might as well be a Lexus. | |||
| Chris Gillings Frequent User Username: chrisg Post Number: 39 Registered: 5-2001 |
From "The Rolls-Royce Twenty" by John Fasal (p 48): "Royce had made plans for changing the traditional radiator shape, to be less wind-resistant and less costly to manufacture. That master of Rolls-Royce publicity, Claude Johnson, insisted that the elegant classical line of the radiator be retained." So we're indebted primarily to 'CJ' for the iconic and universally recognised shape of the Rolls-Royce radiator being maintained. It's a pity there's no-one in authority today that will emulate him. | |||
| Robert Wort Grand Master Username: robert_wort Post Number: 276 Registered: 12-2004 |
So true Chris. So true | |||
| John Shostrom Experienced User Username: silvawraith2 Post Number: 37 Registered: 4-2005 |
Hello Robert and Chris. Yes indeed, we are indebted to CJ in this respect. And so true with what VW have done with the Bentley grille. How can we get across to the powers that be at RR the importance of the grille? That grille, the Spirit of Ecstasy, and the RR badge are the three most universally-recognised symbols of excellence. | |||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 579 Registered: 4-2003 |
To quote a cliche: "Never has a truer word been spoken" My sentiments exactly. | |||
| Glenn Amer Experienced User Username: recordo Post Number: 19 Registered: 4-2005 |
I know you'll hate me for saying this publicly, but I like Nubar Gulbenkian's car. Not as much as my Shadow, but I certainly wouldn't mind having that Wraith in my garage. Here's a photo of what the gentleman looked like. regards, Glenn.  | |||
| Robert Wort Grand Master Username: robert_wort Post Number: 278 Registered: 12-2004 |
We don't hate you at all Glenn. Each to their own. By the way, when are you taking delivery of your new white stick?  | |||
| John Shostrom Experienced User Username: silvawraith2 Post Number: 38 Registered: 4-2005 |
Hello Gentlemen -- and no, we don't hate you, Glenn! Pantechnicon was an interesting car when I saw it -- the woodwork was lacquered to match the exterior paint colour. If you are interested, the car in the photo you submitted is presently for sale at Frank Dale: www.frankdale.com and it really is quite lovely. It was also used in the film "Withnail & I". But back to the real issue: The Grille. It is so periously important to keep it as it is. Good design is timeless, and that grille has certainly withstood the test of time. To emphasise how important it is, The Peninsula Hotel here has just ordered a new fleet of Phantoms. They've had excellent service from their Crewe Rolls-Royces over the years -- I just saw a late Spur of theirs in for service with just over 480,000kms on the clock. But, in the end, it is that grille, that lady, and that badge that the customers recognise, respect and want. Surely, if it is allowed to change shape or slope, the same thing will happen with RR as with Bentley. | |||
| bob uk Unregistered guest Posted From: 80.3.64.11 |
Rolls-Royce had no control over what their customers put on the chassis that was owned by the customer. Coachbuliders would suggest designs that would enhance the project but some customers would have their way regardless. Typical they would add so much bling that the car would be overweight. When the customer had lost interest because the car was horrible Rolls-Royce would wait until the car turned up at auction buy it back rebody the car and sell it on as reconditioned. This is one of the reasons that so many of the chassised cars appear to have been updated by the factory. Example --early cars would be fitted with front brakes making the car appear much later than it really is. Fortunately most of the older RR around now are nice looking. If RR still made seperate chassised cars some idiot with more money than sense would buy one and build a body out of chip board. A friend of mine "discovered" that the Ford Blue Oval badge was stuck on and cheap so he brought 5 and stuck them every where on his Cortina he was convinced the car looked better. Definately a Ford. (Message approved by david_gore) | |||
| Robert Wort Grand Master Username: robert_wort Post Number: 283 Registered: 12-2004 |
Hi Bob. Rolls-Royce may not have had the control over design in the past. But they certainly do now. Our beloved grille has remained relatively the same for 100 years until now. The trouble is that many ‘Yuppies’ (Is that word still in use?) only buy cars like 101EX for the ‘Bling’ value and not for it’s heritage. R-R really means nothing to them and is soon cast aside like a spoilt child’s toy. No doubt it will help BMW’s bottom line but it will do no favours for the name itself. I certainly have no power to sway opinion but it would be nice for those that do to send a clear message to the company that stuffing around with the grille is simply not on ‘Old Chap.’ | |||
| John Shostrom Experienced User Username: silvawraith2 Post Number: 41 Registered: 4-2005 |
Well put, Robert, and in my mind, so true. But it seems in many ways that BMW are looking for the "bling" value to attract people to their products -- and that includes Rolls-Royce. In the end, I rather doubt it will do anything even for BMW's bottom line, and in future this might be looked at as a folly. A really, really good designer should, however difficult it is, be able to design coachwork that works well with the traditional RR grille. | |||
| Robert Wort Grand Master Username: robert_wort Post Number: 321 Registered: 12-2004 |
Unfortunately, when a company produces the ultimate motorcar, someone will always follow up with the ultimate in crass. Scanned from the Robb Report Collections Magazine, is an advert by Team Jubilee for the Allure and S5 LUV’s. No, this is not a typo; LUV stands for Luxury Utility Vehicle. In this instance, these renamed SUV’s are both based on the Goodwood Phantom, even though one is badged as a Bentley (Not sure what Bentley Motors will do about this). In any case, they are about as tasteful as chocolate coated vomit.
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| Glenn Amer Experienced User Username: recordo Post Number: 20 Registered: 4-2005 |
those LUVs make dear Nubar's car look like a classic now, don't they! Bring back the Silver Shadow, I say... | |||
| bob uk Unregistered guest Posted From: brig-cache-4.server.ntli.net |
What were they thinking. They weren't. There is no real market for these vehicles, to me an SUV is a 4x4 like a Jeep or a Range Rover. I have a Cherokee because it tows my caravan out of muddy fields, which my Shadow won't. I should think Phantom 7 with its 2 wheel drive will fair no better. Also the Jeep is like an estate car. --- quite usefull. People who buy SUV may not ever need the 4 wheel drive but they want 4wd even if it only so they think they can drive up a mountain, it gives them a sense of adventure. Incidently the Cherokee is used as 2wd normally and sits lower than the Range Rover giving a more road bias than the Range Rover. The Cherokee drives more car like, but has no where near the off road capability of the Range Rover. Also the dash board design of the Cherokee is horrid and badly made with substandard plastic wood and even substandard plastic plastic. My dash board does not appear to actually fit the car! The air con vents point the wrong way. But it was cheap. (Message approved by david_gore) | |||
| Robert Wort Grand Master Username: robert_wort Post Number: 339 Registered: 12-2004 |
As if the Chrysler 300C isn’t ugly enough already, this twit has even bastardized the Rolls-Royce name by adding a look alike grille to his. http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2286705  | |||
| John Shostrom Frequent User Username: silvawraith2 Post Number: 60 Registered: 4-2005 |
Hi Robert. Unfortunately I have seen thousands of cars in the US with such grilles. In the late seventies, such add-ons were the domain of the proprietors of the world's oldest profession. Somehow, it spread to the upper middle class and Cadillacs everywhere had such grilles. After that, gold-plating came into vogue. To make matters worse, some of these people were able to get into heavily-used Silver Clouds and Shadows, and those poor cars received the same treatment, often with super-wide whitewall tyres, a la Al Capone. Hmmmmmmm .... |
LUV's