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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 873
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Tuesday, 01 May, 2018 - 22:35:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Out of approximately 530 Carmargues how many still exist in running or laid up form but complete?

Value: The Hunt House documents show the original invoice in November 1976 of 29682 sterling in London before the car embarked by ship to Hong Kong. Using an inflation calculator that figure was 200,957 Sterling in 2017 and at present exchange rate is $366,109 AUD.

The cheapest Camargue I have spotted in Australia in the last five years was $100,000 minus $1 and the most expensive was $295,000.

World wide the cheapest place is the USA around 50 to 60 grand but all are LHD.

Mine is one of the 184 RHD versions made.

The more I look into the matter of evaluating my car the more I think its practically impossible to value but Just Cars Magazine lists an A condition Camargue at $133,000 down from $140,000 3 years ago.

Rust wise only a hole the size of a dime on the left hand rear wheel arch. It arrived from New York with a note saying the third cylinder on DS was down on compression. I have stripped the engine down and cannot locate any problem at all. This car is complete and if I have to spend more than 10 grand in parts to get it on the road that will be surprising.

As is sitting two metres from me, the car cost including purchase and freight owes me only $26,000 AUD total which I think is jolly good value for money.

Having the mechanical and paint and panel skills to fix it properly puts me is a comfortable position.

Camargue like Caviar are an acquired taste. Brian I am certain would rather have a Shadow run over his foot than be seen driving a Camargue let alone owning one.
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1476
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Wednesday, 02 May, 2018 - 04:06:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

you either love them or hate them.
personally i think they are amazing cars.
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Brian Vogel
Grand Master
Username: guyslp

Post Number: 2549
Registered: 6-2009
Posted on Thursday, 03 May, 2018 - 12:53:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vladimir wrote, of me, Brian I am certain would rather have a Shadow run over his foot than be seen driving a Camargue let alone owning one.

You are indeed correct. I have managed over the course of decades of reflection and revisiting various things that I could learn to love some of them. My feelings about the Camargue as a design disaster have only become more entrenched after the same reflection and revisitation. A sloppy box on wheels that was Pininfarina's greatest mistake. I don't know what he was on.

But, at the same time, I live and die by, "Chacun à son goût." It's great that there is a niche where Camargues are adored.
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 880
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Thursday, 03 May, 2018 - 20:05:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Now now Brian have you ever seen a black Camargue?. They look very swanky, and very very regal. Something about the colour of a Camargue makes a world of difference. Google Rolls Royce Camargue and then go to images and scroll down.

There is a black Camargue up against a brick building. Even you I am sure as the Forums most anti-camargueist cannot resist its evil stance.

...Then again perhaps you can!
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Brian Vogel
Grand Master
Username: guyslp

Post Number: 2550
Registered: 6-2009
Posted on Friday, 04 May, 2018 - 00:33:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vladimir,

I cannot disagree with you in any way that paint color makes a world of difference in how the Camargue presents.

It's just where our respective endpoints on the "scale of attractiveness" lie, and I suspect the very upper end of mine is the very lower end of yours.

Brian, a pretty box is a pretty box, but it isn't a sensuous automobile
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Patrick Ryan
Grand Master
Username: patrick_r

Post Number: 1880
Registered: 4-2016
Posted on Saturday, 05 May, 2018 - 05:56:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vlad,
Is this the car you are referring to?
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 896
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Sunday, 06 May, 2018 - 21:39:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Patrick it is indeed and thanks for putting it up. Any chance you can post the rear and side view as well Patrick?

If that car does not look pure swank I don't know what does but the front painted all white including the headlight surrounds on an identical Camargue is definitely a tad rough on the eye.
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Patrick Ryan
Grand Master
Username: patrick_r

Post Number: 1891
Registered: 4-2016
Posted on Sunday, 06 May, 2018 - 22:09:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Here you go mate.
As you know I am not a fan of these, but I can appreciate them for what they are.





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ross kowalski
Grand Master
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 768
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Sunday, 06 May, 2018 - 23:30:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vlad,

How rough is yours? Did you ever post pics?

The car has a lot of 70's styling cues going on which is not in everyone's taste (including my own) but will definitely be a car to have in a RR collection. If I had more room and less cars, I would love to have one.

Also, are those red lights below the bumper fog lights?
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 176
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Sunday, 06 May, 2018 - 23:41:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

This was the Camargue that was converted to a Bentley with Ferrari taillights. I photographed it at the 2013 RREC annual. It is also the car that Omar recently witnessed in an unfortunate rear-ender. It is a small world for these cars.

bencam
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1500
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Monday, 07 May, 2018 - 04:46:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

It was heartbreaking to see this very car on the side of the road with front all smashed in.
And for me to have traveled all the way to the UK to endure that torture first hand.....
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 36
Registered: 7-2016
Posted on Monday, 07 May, 2018 - 07:32:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Evening Gents, I thought I'd throw in my two half'penny re. design.

To my eye, the Carmargue is ungainly, I recall it's launch all those years ago when Shirley Bassey was lauded as a valued Client.

The problem stems from the depth of its side profile. The fluidity of line, poise, cabin to body ratio, everything else is there but alas body mass is wrong.

The elegance that is viewed in the 130, 400, Maremma, Fiat 131 is sadly missing from the Carmargue.

Where we are duped is in colour, in stockings and suspenders....

We look and we admire and we turn a blind eye based upon its "Come to Market Price", smoke and mirrors "Shirley Bassey"

I don't like to say it when I know there are owners and admirers and I stand in line to be shot at with my gold mascot and whitewall tyres (both of which I deplore)...

+++ jpeg +++ 31213 +++ Carmargue

+++Design
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 898
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Monday, 07 May, 2018 - 07:46:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Ross mine is 8/10 and certainly can't be called rough. The lights under the front bumper are fog lights. Photos of my Camargue were posted some time back and can be found in search.

Being a tad eccentric, I think the Camargue was made for me and I am probably lucky as if a Camargue was as pretty as a Shadow or Spirit the the price to buy one would be crazy.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 781
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Monday, 07 May, 2018 - 10:40:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

There is a saying among the country folk that the worst day fishing still beats the best day at work. By the same token, any Rolls-Royce is better than no Rolls-Royce. That said, stylistically it is hard to improve on the Shadow (of course not including anything previously, he said, being a pre-war and EPW aficionado!), but every Mother loves her baby...awkward though it might be.

.
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Paul Marshall
Experienced User
Username: welshbentleyboy

Post Number: 15
Registered: 4-2017
Posted on Tuesday, 08 May, 2018 - 05:20:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I have always loved the shape of the Camargue.

I love the 1980s cars. I have bid several times for Aston Martin Lagonda's and have owned a Lotus Elite and Excel. Long live the wedge! Except the British Leyland Ambassoaors.

In the Uk when I first looked at a Camargue £18,000 would have bought a cracker.Isn't hindsight a wonderful thing!

Paul
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 900
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Tuesday, 08 May, 2018 - 05:35:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Paul the Arnage T. Does the bugger hoot? I may be forced to buy one sooner than later to match my Two RR in effort to convince local cowgirls I am not loaded as some wag once uttered " a Bentley is a poor man's Rolls Royce" .....
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Patrick Lockyer.
Grand Master
Username: pat_lockyer

Post Number: 1856
Registered: 9-2004
Posted on Tuesday, 08 May, 2018 - 06:17:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Oh dear and I bought the new at the time Wolseley 18/2200 sent it back to the factory for engine mounting mods to move the engine to get the drive shafts positioned correctly [manual box] with suspension travel.

They only manufactured the auto type for some time and then call it a Princess. Once sorted the car was a flier even though it had a 4 speed box.

As for the Camargue, Farina did a cracking design job of making a large car with two doors. Refined and built by Mulliner Park Ward up to the middle of 1978 then by RR at Crewe.

IMO the car has style that would be today called a cross over to the next generation of models to come ie 4 door Spirit and Spur.

What the current design of cars are now makes me think about a Tank on wheels!
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ross kowalski
Grand Master
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 769
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Tuesday, 08 May, 2018 - 08:27:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vlad,
8/10?? It must take good pictures, because it really shows well.
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 901
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Tuesday, 08 May, 2018 - 12:04:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Ross did you find the photos of my white Camargue on the forum?
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ross kowalski
Grand Master
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 772
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Tuesday, 08 May, 2018 - 12:12:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vlad, Site search and there it was.
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Jean-Pierre 'JP' Hilbert
Prolific User
Username: jphilbert

Post Number: 173
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, 16 May, 2018 - 02:02:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Joining the conversation late, the sistership of the Camargue is the Ferrari 412, and everything that Pininfarina did wrong on the Camargue, they did right on the 412, IMHO.
The 412 is the only Ferrari that I could imagine buying, the Camargue is the only RR that I'd never consider owning. Any yet, both are so, so similar.
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Paul Marshall
Experienced User
Username: welshbentleyboy

Post Number: 16
Registered: 4-2017
Posted on Thursday, 17 May, 2018 - 05:17:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

As an 80s fan I have already listed my lust list.
I have not owned a Ferrari 412 but I have owned a Ferrari 400i. I struggle to see why car buyers fight over Daytonas where as there are to my eye many similar design features in a 400i.
I had to buy a 400i as my long legs would not fit in a mid engine Ferrari. I later graduated to a 456 . One of the best cars I ever owned. Should Have kept it!
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Brian Vogel
Grand Master
Username: guyslp

Post Number: 2566
Registered: 6-2009
Posted on Thursday, 17 May, 2018 - 09:18:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

JP wrote, in part: ". . . everything that Pininfarina did wrong on the Camargue, they did right on the 412, IMHO."

And in mine as well. Sleek from front to back, with distinct edges and creases, but not a "box" in sight!

Brian
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 908
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Saturday, 19 May, 2018 - 09:50:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I would love to own a 412 but sadly world lunacy has driven the prices of Ferraris and Aston Martins to Mexican Mango Madness levels.

The shape of Camargue's sides and rear I find to be superb. The front ah well looks better in black than white. I think the headlight assemblies if recessed quite a tad would really make the car much more attractive to many.

However. Its horses for courses and its the same with admiration of the female form. I like red hair and long red hair with freckles and the Marilyn Monroe shape but that is not every bodies cup of tea. Put simply Fergie was hot but Diana was not.
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1519
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Sunday, 20 May, 2018 - 04:03:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I will confess that I had to do a search for what a 412 looked like. Ferraris do it for me like Toyota Camrys. No desire there at all....
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Paul Marshall
Experienced User
Username: welshbentleyboy

Post Number: 17
Registered: 4-2017
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 04:20:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Oh Omar! What an admission.
I have had two Ferrari and to discard them so lightly does poor appreciation of the marque. Breathtaking power, looks, road holding and public admiration.If you drive a Ferrari in Italy you can appreciate that you are driving a national icon.
Don't knock it if you haven't tried it.
Paul
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1527
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 05:20:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

one day I may try one Paul.
But it would not be because i have any desire for the marque. I am sure the driving experience will be the clinching force for me.
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Robert Howlett
Prolific User
Username: bobhowlett

Post Number: 184
Registered: 9-2010
Posted on Saturday, 16 June, 2018 - 18:36:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Vladimir

There is another Camargue in Central Queensland.I was parked next to it. We had a school formal at the Ridges resort a few years back and there was a white, right hand drive one there .I thought it was yours, and in mint condition too.
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 45
Registered: 7-2016
Posted on Sunday, 17 June, 2018 - 04:34:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

One for the Carmargue fans c/o Pistonheads :-)


Carmargue
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1557
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Sunday, 17 June, 2018 - 04:47:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

This car is so garish and truly gash that it is absolutely lovely.
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David Gore
Moderator
Username: david_gore

Post Number: 2921
Registered: 4-2003
Posted on Sunday, 17 June, 2018 - 09:45:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I must be ageing faster than I think - I am appreciating and liking the Camargue more than ever. However, the Camargue above, whilst conforming to the R-R tradition of owners with arguable taste modifying their cars in "unusual" ways, is pushing my boundaries!!
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 954
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Sunday, 17 June, 2018 - 09:56:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

The headlights are amber. Who made them? The gold plating I think is not as pretty as chrome and stainless.

My Camargue has a gold Spirit of Ecstacy which I am removing as it reminds me of pretty young ladies with nose rings or eyebrow rings or lip rings - its just Ugggg!
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David Gore
Moderator
Username: david_gore

Post Number: 2925
Registered: 4-2003
Posted on Sunday, 17 June, 2018 - 17:37:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vladimir.

The headlights look like the original clear lenses have been replaced with amber/yellow fog light lenses. Gold-plating the reflector would be very difficult however someone may have been prepared to "give it a go and see what eventuates" and succeeded.

Does anyone know if the radiator shell, wheel discs and door handles are gold-plated as well?

The photo suggests they are and if this is the case, they would be a potent thief/vandal magnet.

.
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 47
Registered: 7-2016
Posted on Tuesday, 19 June, 2018 - 01:19:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Re. Headlamps.

Back in the days when the French had yellow headlamp bulbs (a hangover from the WW2 I believe) you could buy yellow headlamp tint from car accessory shops along with the ubiquitous GB sticker which you proudly placed on the back to show that you "had been abroad"

On your return it washed off with White Spirit but it still proved a challenge in between the Lucas raised lettering on the headlamps.

Later on you could buy yellow plastic covers which also dipped the beam the correct way.

How do I know? t'was my job on the family Jag Mk10 :D
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1567
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Saturday, 23 June, 2018 - 03:20:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hey Vlad - is this a "nice to have" item for your Camargue?

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/223025778552
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 979
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Saturday, 23 June, 2018 - 17:00:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Omar, my Camargue is pretty much complete and I already have those sill pinifarina plates. A rare item though as they would have only been made for Camargues, Camargues being the only Rolls Royce ever designed by that Italian Design Bureau .... or did they design another model?
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1570
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Sunday, 24 June, 2018 - 04:23:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I also have those sill plates on my two Azures but they are Bentleys off course. I believe you are right - The Camargue may be the only Rolls-Royce that would have a Pininfarina body.
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 48
Registered: 7-2016
Posted on Tuesday, 03 July, 2018 - 21:35:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I spy with my little eye...

https://www.xj40.com/viewtopic.php?p=184662#p184662


Camargue 1

Camargue 2
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1580
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Wednesday, 04 July, 2018 - 04:26:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

two of them!!!!
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 1006
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Wednesday, 04 July, 2018 - 06:17:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Actually Omar three! Omar somebody is trying to head you off at the pass by monopolising the Camargue market. Yes indeed! Could it be Brian using a tacky line like " If you show me your Camargue I'll show you my garden and my collection of Trump dart boards!"
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 183
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Wednesday, 04 July, 2018 - 08:17:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I see your three Camargues and I raise you one.



4cam
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David Gore
Moderator
Username: david_gore

Post Number: 2960
Registered: 4-2003
Posted on Wednesday, 04 July, 2018 - 17:01:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Mark,

Where and when??

A "must document for posterity" occasion.
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 184
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Wednesday, 04 July, 2018 - 22:47:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Victoria branch event 09/04 18th April 2004. Visit to Trentham. L-R 1984 AJE08943, 1975 JRH19549, 1981 JRH50643, 1979 JRH50085.

Victoria seems to have a monopoly on Camargues. It is rumoured there are 16 Camargues in Australia. A majority of them must reside in Victoria. To have 0.76% of total production attend a monthly meeting is a pretty good effort.
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1582
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Thursday, 05 July, 2018 - 05:06:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Brian - are you that secret Camargue addict and have been trying deflection tactics on the forum to get us to go off them??? so you can secretly buy them all up......
I am wondering if Vlad is onto something......
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 49
Registered: 7-2016
Posted on Thursday, 05 July, 2018 - 05:53:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

FYI- The Reg. No. of the cream and gold Camargue I posted earlier, is currently on a Corniche.
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 1010
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Thursday, 05 July, 2018 - 09:44:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Mark "16 Camargue in Australia" Okay you have 4 in Victoria shown kindly in your photo. There are definitely 3 in Queensland. Mine, a Hong Kong original via Nebraska and New York, and RHD. Robert in Rockingham saw one the road there and I know of a Green one near Sunshine Coast that was on the market for $115,000.

So that's 7. 8 would include Robert Holmes a'Court's Brown one I saw him driving past University of WA in the early 8Os Havana Cigar smoking.

I did hear that Kerry Packer had one which he had turbo charged. That' 9.

I doubt somewhere as wealthy as WA would only have 1 Camargue so my guess is there are at least 4 in WA somewhere.

That would make 12.

Surely NSW would contain the other 4 putting Packer's aside.

That leaves NT, Tasmania and South Australia. No need to consider ACT on the basis its the home of much government lunacy and Camargue counters have principles!

My guess is there are 2 in SA and one in Tasmania.

I leave NT out of it due to the amount of alcohol involved and the high paid transient population.

If I was right that brings the number to 19 so taking into account things that are variable I think there has to be more than 20.

If I ever get to Hunt House I will see if I can get permission to go through the books and see where all the right hand drive cars went. From memory there were only 184 ever built RHD. Out of that 184
I would say there are 20 to 30 left in UK and maybe 3 in South Africa. Perhaps 2 in New Zealand because I love baiting Kiwi, as they are small and they know it.

Isolated RHD countries aside the rest of the RHD Camargue got croaked by corrosion in Hong Kong.

As for LHD most went to USA and then vanished like Jaguar 420Gs. I pronounce that at most 40 are left. Americans can be horribly hard on cars. Another big part of LHD cars went to the middle east obviously awash with oil dollars.

Camargue are mysterious vehicles. Out of the total of 551 perhaps over half have vanished forever.

They were a rare car new. Now they are super rare. Here is a wild stab in the dark! There are only 60 to 70 RHD Camargue left on the entire planet!

All we need is one good spy movie with a Camargue in it and the value of Camargues will go ballistic.

Any ideas?
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 185
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Thursday, 05 July, 2018 - 22:27:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Ok Lets find them. apart from the four already identified


JRH25623 bogged


jrh25623red

JRH50546

jrh50546

JRH20170

jrh20170


JRH50562 appeared earlier in thread
jrh50562
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 186
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Thursday, 05 July, 2018 - 22:34:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Late Unidentified 'Beau Rivage' currently for sale in Aus was apparently Japanese car show car.



JRH21867 ex well known trucking magnate



jrh21867

JRH26707 in the middle. the two outsiders have already been accounted for.

jrh26707
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 187
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Thursday, 05 July, 2018 - 23:04:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

DZ6 doesnt really count. Experimental and can never be registered. Turbo charged. Used for Bentley Turbo R development. Slightly different body panels and owned by the aforementioned trucking magnate. I have better photos somewhere. apologies.

dz6

AJF10376 one of the last delivered. Also owned by the same trucking magnate. Again apologies for the poor photo, it was taken in a secret lair. Amazing what else was in there!

ajf


We still need to find photos of known Aussie residents:
JRH17304
JRH31364
JRH32954
JRH50244
JRH50758
JRH8726(sic) Seen listed as '84 but incorrect JRH number. needs further investigation.
AJD07285
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 1014
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Friday, 06 July, 2018 - 06:08:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Mark where is DZ6? In Mount Coolon registration is not required. Well maybe its legally required but in order to stop the locals from driving unregistered the cops would need more power than they can ever muster because as soon as they come to town (very rare) everybody knows about it about an hour before!

This is the first I have ever seen of a Camargue with US Spirit/Spur lights. I like it.

Where is it?

And don't tell Omar because more than likely he could get it registered in Dubai as Dubai is a place like its not what you know its who you know.....
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 188
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Friday, 06 July, 2018 - 23:08:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

We now have JRH17304. This was a trials publicity and development car. Quite an interesting history.

jrh17304

Thanks to Praeclarum 03-03 for JRH31364.



jrh31364


Only a handfull left to find
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 189
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Friday, 06 July, 2018 - 23:15:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

A better shot of DZ6. It now resides in the Fox Classic Car collection in Melbourne. Note Chamfered front guards and mismatched seats. It was under constant development before being used for a time at the RR School of Instruction.


dz6
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Chris Gillings
Prolific User
Username: chrisg

Post Number: 139
Registered: 4-2001
Posted on Saturday, 07 July, 2018 - 11:22:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Seen at the NSW Branch Concours 2017-11-12.

JRH31364
JRH31364
Possibly JRH50758
JRH50578
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Chris Gillings
Prolific User
Username: chrisg

Post Number: 140
Registered: 4-2001
Posted on Saturday, 07 July, 2018 - 11:41:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

From Praeclarum No.2-76 (Apr 1976): JRH21866 "Our first Camargue"
JRH21866

From Praeclarum No.1-84 (Feb 1984): AJCO4495
AJCO4495

From Praeclarum No.6-97 (Dec 1997): BJF10150 at RREC Rally.
BJF10150
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1589
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Saturday, 07 July, 2018 - 18:11:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

This was the car that I saw with its front end all smashed on the motorway in the UK last year.
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Mark Herbstreit
Prolific User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 190
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Saturday, 07 July, 2018 - 23:36:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Correction Omar, this is the one and only production Bentley Camargue. The one you saw was a Rolls Royce conversion.

Thanks Chris for filling in some blanks. I think JRH21866, our first, Camargue is actually 21867 the brown car above. I believe AJF10376 was the last delivered. The same magnate owned both at one stage.
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1590
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Sunday, 08 July, 2018 - 05:13:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

You are probably right Mark.
'The car I saw had a Bentley grill and was black. It also had round lights at the back
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Grand Master
Username: soviet

Post Number: 1015
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Sunday, 08 July, 2018 - 05:48:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I own JRH23682. Today I will dig through 8 plus years of Just Cars and Unique Cars magazines to locate the green Camargue that was selling for $115,000 AUD and see where the car is. I doubt it sold but I did many years ago talk to the owner who had a British voice, said the car was immaculate and he clearly was in no hurry to part with it.

There is a remote possibility that Robert from Rockingham may spot the Camargue he saw down there and inquire about the serial number.

The more I see photos of Camargue, the further I fall in love with the look of them.

Criticism of their shape to me is just babbling nonsense from people who will never own one and probably have never seen one in the flesh. Camargue simply reek of elegance, brutish power, money type ELEGANCE.

When new these cars sold to people who were definitely not flipping burgers for a crust and yet today a burger flipper could buy one if he was a saver and could find one.

There will come a day as a number of high end dealers in London have said when Camargue prices will rise substantially. OK if you want to sell and bloody useless if you are a life time owner like me who will never sell.

I would live on whatever is edible in the local weir before dropping JRH23682 on the market at any price. Its called Camargue Craziness and there is no cure!
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Greg Skinner
Yet to post message
Username: margie

Post Number: 1
Registered: 12-2018
Posted on Saturday, 11 January, 2020 - 11:21:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I am the owner of JRH21867. Has previously been owned twice by Lindsay Fox. Still has the collection sticker on the rear window.

Have now finished bringing it back, as closely as possible, to its build sheets.

This includes the following:-

Reattached the front and rear fog lamps

Recovering the front seats squab & backrests & armrests

Had custom made facia panels and installed an original 8 Track player and radio, also 4 original specification speakers.
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Chris Gillings
Experienced User
Username: chrisg

Post Number: 146
Registered: 04-2001
Posted on Saturday, 11 January, 2020 - 11:45:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

At the Sydney All-British Day in 2018 we were treated to a rare sight indeed.

Four Camargues
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Glen Poolen
Frequent User
Username: wgipps

Post Number: 212
Registered: 03-2018
Posted on Saturday, 11 January, 2020 - 15:29:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Little off topic but i did find this while surfing around -
https://www.rrsilvershadow.com/EGall/ERRCamconv1978JRX31741.htm
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gordon le feuvre
Frequent User
Username: triumph

Post Number: 328
Registered: 07-2012
Posted on Saturday, 11 January, 2020 - 22:37:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

WE AS CHANNEL ISLES DEALER (UKNOT OFF COAST OF LA)
WERE ONLY ALLOCATED ONE CAR. IT RETAILED HERE AT £32K. MADE LOCAL FRONT PAGE AS MOST EXPENSIVE CAR EVER SOLD HERE. COUPLE WEEKS LATER, OWNER SOLD IT IN LONDON FOR £38? R-R WERE NOT IMPRESSED TO SAY THE LEAST, NOT TO SAY OUR SALES DIRECTOR
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Larry Kavanagh
Frequent User
Username: shadow_11

Post Number: 555
Registered: 05-2016
Posted on Sunday, 12 January, 2020 - 02:51:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

While that "Hunting" Camargue is a wonderful piece of customisation I think an open top 4x4 Land Rover or Toyota Landcruiser would have been a more practical hunting vehicle. Imagine getting gun oil on those lovely Camargue leather seats.
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 57
Registered: 07-2016
Posted on Saturday, 07 March, 2020 - 04:48:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Apologise for not posting for a while "life is what happens whilst you're busy planning it" is an oft quoted expression of mine.

My wonderful Shadow2 sits outside the barn, exposed to all elements awaiting an application of cash, some remedial bodywork to the lower front wing and some general TLC but that all…...sigh..

I have an undiminished love for the old girl, but the launch of a new business ,my XJ40 Supercharged project, and the arrival of a certain feline XK150 V8 with flappy paddles have taken the temporary limelight away..but I know she’s there…

Side- step….Larry K..was that your SS I spied in Thomastown Eire, whilst I was across? I got all excited until my dearest (the second one after the Shadow – joke!) calmed me down!)
Back to the post…

I’ve commented, as have others, that although the principle of the Camargue is undisputed, the reality, in my eyes was poorly executed; my comments on 400i and 130 Coupe still stand.
Nonetheless the engineering integrity and vision remain valid and thus when I saw a recently advertised Camargue, (Dutch I think) my mind started to wonder (or should that be wander?)

I played around with MS Paint shop, and, as can clearly see, I’m no wizard, but drawing (sic) down the bonnet line, reducing the mass of the grille produced an improved result in my eyes; I struggle to find the design/engineering conflict that produced such a calamitous and overtly massive radiator grille. If someone is more competent then if they could perhaps realign the front indicators to bumper ratio it might produce a more elegant result.?

I still hold the principle that the overall body/height ratio is wrong, which is why the Camargue is held back from being an elegant design, I don’t hold to the dictum that mass abhors elegance, but the key ratios must hold. I think I said in a previous post that we are duped by smoke and mirrors

My own result is somewhat Frura Jaguar and dare one say it Excalibar! (shock!) but heh! We’re an eclectic, mature, friendly bunch, aren’t we?

Comments?

Carmargue

.
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David Gore
Moderator
Username: david_gore

Post Number: 3624
Registered: 04-2003
Posted on Saturday, 07 March, 2020 - 14:56:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Mike,

You almost gave Vladimir a fatal heart attack with your post above but he has now partially recovered to send me the following message to post on his behalf:

"Well Michael I must give you a high mark for bravery but sub zero for failure.

Really I do humbly yap that your redesign of the front of a Camargue by a reduction in radiator grill size produced a thoroughly horrid result.

I have no idea what Rolls Royce wrote in their brief to Pininfarina, but perhaps one day I will track the letter down as it would make serious reading.

What we know is both Rolls Royce and Pininfarina both approved the Camargue and that both companies have been nothing short of spectacular at their relative tasks.

The beauty of a Camargue is its in your face aggression which states I am not only the most expensive Rolls Royce available 1975 - 1986 but on release the most expensive car in the world.

The list of original owners is more than impressive internationally.

I would be the first to say my Deep Purple Spirit is more feminine type pretty than my Camargue but really a Spirit or a Shadow though related they do not rest on the same status level.

Camargues are not photogenic except at certain angles. Seeing a Camargue in real life and seeing photos of one are two distinct things.

Driving a Camargue means you will never have much of a chance of being passed by another though in the Southern States of Australia they have been known to congregate in single digits on Rolls Royce show days.

Camargues are nothing less than elite.

I have seen an Pininfarina Fiat 130. A totally mad often drunk as a Lord, Judge who lived next door to me had one. Fiat's adventurism into the luxury car market saw them run out of the market in a extremely short time. Fiat 130's were flimsy pieces of work.

The blackening of the head light surrounds of the Camargue on a white car really does change its appearance for the better but that's about the only modification that would not seriously devalue a Camargue apart from one hard top convertible in the USA.

Modifying a Camargue would be only bested by attempting to improve the Crown Jewels or your wedding tackle with rusty tin snips while blasted on Marilyn Manson's 66.6% Absinthe."


.
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Larry Kavanagh
Frequent User
Username: shadow_11

Post Number: 596
Registered: 05-2016
Posted on Sunday, 08 March, 2020 - 06:13:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Michael, My Silver Shadow 11 has been in Thomastown on a few occasions but not within the past year or thereabouts. Mine is nutmeg brown in colour and is currently in storage while awaiting an air-con refurb. Thomastown is about 20 miles from my place, there's an active group of classic car enthusiasts in the locality, in Thomastown itself there an insurance broker who specialises in classic/vintage insurance.
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Mark Herbstreit
Frequent User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 207
Registered: 05-2005
Posted on Wednesday, 11 March, 2020 - 22:09:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

A must have for every Camargue owner

cam
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 58
Registered: 07-2016
Posted on Friday, 03 April, 2020 - 01:15:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

That is nice Mark. I'm currently cowering under the settee afraid that my Carmargue's remarks will send a certain Russian Oligarth (aren't they all?) namely Vladimir across the pond to see me...

Fortunately, when funds allow, I have the opportunity to escape across to Kilkenny to get my RR "fix"

I see that there is six meter distancing, Covid19, meeting scheduled later this year - would love to attend for the craic! the cash haemorrhage and everything thing else lays best plans to mice and men will determine, albeit the heart and mind are willing.

Everything else is all good.

Thxn for post

Best.

Mike
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Omar M. Shams
Prolific User
Username: omar

Post Number: 1980
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Wednesday, 08 April, 2020 - 15:39:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

My friend James who has the Hooper 2 door Turbo R also has a Camargue. I am trying to get him to join this forum to share photos of this car too.
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Omar M. Shams
Prolific User
Username: omar

Post Number: 1983
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Friday, 10 April, 2020 - 18:13:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

James has registered with the forum and has been waiting to get approval in order to contribute. Does it take a long time for new members to get approval?
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David Gore
Moderator
Username: david_gore

Post Number: 3661
Registered: 04-2003
Posted on Saturday, 11 April, 2020 - 08:35:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Omar,

Our Administrator usually approves new members promptly - it will depend on where he is and what he is doing over the Easter "holiday" [or should I say lockdown?].
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James de Saint-Evremond
Yet to post message
Username: evremond

Post Number: 1
Registered: 04-2020
Posted on Tuesday, 14 April, 2020 - 02:18:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thank you Omar for the kind introduction and respects to All.

I attach a few photos of my current RR Camargue project.

I hope purists will forgive my jettisoning the hideous rear lights and replacing them with what Paola Martin had planned.

The Hooper two-tone color scheme sets off the car's best feature, the beautiful rear flying buttresses and relieves the otherwise slabby side profile...at least to this owner's eyes.
application/zip
RR Camargue Jebel Ali arrival.rtfd.zip (1.4 k)
application/octet-stream
RR Camargue colour test (1623.0 k)
application/octet-stream
RR Camargue with prototype rear lights (1652.6 k)
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Omar M. Shams
Prolific User
Username: omar

Post Number: 1986
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Tuesday, 14 April, 2020 - 02:38:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

sorry James.....
cant open the files....
You need to attach photos that are smaller than 640ish x 480ish pixels.

Moderator Input: I have now found the forum software will accept a maximum photo width of 800 pixels which allows viewing without having to scroll across the screen to view the entire image.

I have discovered if you right click on the image file, it will open in a new window in its entirety rather than inside the post as usual without requiring scrolling.
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 59
Registered: 07-2016
Posted on Thursday, 16 April, 2020 - 06:11:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Just appeared on UK Fleabay

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1976-Rolls-Royce-Camargue/324135454212?hash=item4b77fa8604:g:gAAAAOSwjONeOY~F

delivered 21st of October 1976 to of all places Eaton Mansions, Eaton Place, Sloane Square, London SW1. Finished in Sepia with Nuella Green Gold interior chassis JRH23680 has just been released from long term storage"

E Bay Carmargue
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Michael Carr
Experienced User
Username: carsie

Post Number: 60
Registered: 07-2016
Posted on Thursday, 16 April, 2020 - 06:15:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

James de S-E, very nice indeed! Interesting thoughts on the rear lights 365/400? - Not interested in my thoughts for the nose? ..run's for cover lol!

Thnx for post, keep them coming please.
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Omar M. Shams
Prolific User
Username: omar

Post Number: 1989
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Friday, 17 April, 2020 - 20:22:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I am looking forward to seeing James' Camargue in the flesh soon.
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James de Saint-Evremond
New User
Username: evremond

Post Number: 2
Registered: 04-2020
Posted on Sunday, 19 April, 2020 - 18:17:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Apologies for the delay in re-sizing these images,
I have added fine silver fleches a la Hooper along the edges of the bonnet's central ridge which I shall show in future photos.

The bumper and the wiring to the rectangular red central fog-light (not recoloured red yet) can only be completed once odd bits of dashboard re-upholsteryare completed and the dashboard re-installed for testing.

You are correct, Michael, that the lights are off the Ferrari 412 as earlier carried on the Fiat Spyder. The Fiat Spyder Club in Italy furnished them.

Happy to hear your views for the front....perhaps?











Hi James, I have reformatted your text to give extra magnificence to your outstanding vehicle images. If you resize your future photos to a maximum width of 800 pixels, these will fit the screen whilst showing the detail to best advantage. I always reformat my images to 300dpi resolution and save them before resizing. Regards David

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James de Saint-Evremond
New User
Username: evremond

Post Number: 3
Registered: 04-2020
Posted on Sunday, 19 April, 2020 - 20:36:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

By way of seeking your indulgence for my "rectifying" the rear lights I attach a photo of the 1968 Paolo Martin Bentley T-Speciale which was the erstwhile prototype for the Bentley Camargue; which then became a RR Camargue as by 1975 the only viable market was the USA.
The rear flying buttress survived to production.

I used to drive this car when it was a very dark green before its latest restoration.The restoration is spectacular although I would have retained solid colour paintwork.
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Omar M. Shams
Prolific User
Username: omar

Post Number: 1991
Registered: 04-2009
Posted on Sunday, 19 April, 2020 - 23:03:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I cant see the fletches on the bonnet James
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James de Saint-Evremond
New User
Username: evremond

Post Number: 4
Registered: 04-2020
Posted on Monday, 20 April, 2020 - 03:54:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Omar,
The fleches are just visible in the very small first photograph. They were added after the earlier larger photos had been taken.
J
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Larry Kavanagh
Frequent User
Username: shadow_11

Post Number: 619
Registered: 05-2016
Posted on Monday, 20 April, 2020 - 05:42:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Absolutely stunning, awesome motor car, enjoy, Larry

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