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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Prolific User
Username: soviet

Post Number: 192
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Tuesday, 31 March, 2015 - 11:34:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Bob, I have the flat piece of toughened glass which I managed to cut out from its hideous rubber seal on an old Ford Falcon ute I scrounge parts from the keep the pano of the road. Pretty sure its dead flat as I placed a brand new 1.2 mitre Stabila (made in Germany) brick layers level against it.

I have also some 1000 grit wet and dry and the flat glass piece is 1.2 metres long and 28cm wide which is wider than the cylinder head.

I am wondering if the best method is to secure the cylinder head to my work table where I can get at it from all sides and glue the wet and dry paper with superglue to the glass then draw the glass backwards and forwards along the cylinder head and using bearing blue as a check tool, take enough metal off it until the blue shows complete contact with the block, or alternatively secure the glass to the work table, having glued the wet and dry to the glass and then move the cylinder head back and forth over the wet and dry.

The second method would mean that the weight of the cylinder head would assist in the decking down.

Which way would you do it?
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richard george yeaman
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Username: richyrich

Post Number: 267
Registered: 4-2012
Posted on Tuesday, 31 March, 2015 - 18:18:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Vladimir I would use the second option make sure the table is free from irregularities I have used a similar method using valve grinding paste.

Richard.
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Mark Aldridge
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Username: mark_aldridge

Post Number: 202
Registered: 10-2008
Posted on Tuesday, 31 March, 2015 - 18:30:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vladimir,, I have used the second method successfully.
Mark
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Jean-Pierre 'JP' Hilbert
Frequent User
Username: jphilbert

Post Number: 53
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Tuesday, 31 March, 2015 - 20:06:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Vlad,
I'd take it to a pro, with precision cutting tools and a purpose-build flat table. It's not expensive and you can blame somebody else if the results are not good.
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Bob UK
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 94.197.120.140
Posted on Wednesday, 01 April, 2015 - 07:29:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I would use the second method that is using the weight of the head.

If a machine shop can take off 4 thou only then that's the best option. However some surfacing machines like a deeper cut. Which may led to shorter push rods.

(Message approved by david_gore)
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Prolific User
Username: soviet

Post Number: 199
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Saturday, 04 April, 2015 - 02:35:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Jean-Pierre, I would love to take the cylinder heads to a specialist. The nearest one would be about a thousand miles away and I would never trust a transport company with the cylinder heads.

I am going with the risk of self decking as I have nothing to loose and its as cheap as. Far too late to cry over ones Spirit of Ecstacy when you hear "oh sorry mate, the apprentice we gave the job to took 20 thou off the heads, bloody idiot".

These days putting your trust in any specialist with all the right gear leads to taking the risk that your prized parts are not going to be treated with the care you would expect.

Doing the decking down myself I know I am either going to get it right or stuff it right up and that is a risk I feel comfortable with.
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richard george yeaman
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Username: richyrich

Post Number: 274
Registered: 4-2012
Posted on Wednesday, 15 April, 2015 - 20:35:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Vladimir just wondering have you started the deck down yet and if so what is the early findings.

Richard.
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Vladimir Ivanovich Kirillov
Prolific User
Username: soviet

Post Number: 201
Registered: 2-2013
Posted on Thursday, 16 April, 2015 - 05:56:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Yes Richard I have started to deck down the Camargue's cylinder heads. First I prefer the method of having the surface area of the cylinder head facing up and using the flat glass with 80 grit wet and dry sand paper taped to it, moving the glass up and down the cylinder head slowly while holding the sand paper in a pincher grip with thumbs and middle finger on its leading edge. The reason the other method of having the cylinder head sitting with its weight on the paper does not work is the friction is so great that the paper will tear to pieces as soon as the cylinder head moves. The first method I have detailed worked beautifully. However, the idea of using bearing blue to check for trueness went the way of a losing lottery ticket. It is not possible to use bearing blue method where you have cylinder liners that sit proud of the cylinder block.

It has just occurred to me that one bearing blue method could be to smear the flat glass with bearing blue then sit it upon the surface area of the cylinder head. Provided the glass was flat then the bearing blue would indicate where the cylinder head surface was not flat. That leaves one to trust the assumption that the block surface is flat and lets face it if it isn't flat you are up the proverbial creek in a barbed wire canoe without a paddle because it is a horror story to remove the cylinder liners and a supercharged horror story to remove the studs as one fine American gentleman has detailed previously in this forum.

Obviously, the liners and studs would need removing if one had to machine the surface of the block to get it flat and that in turn creates all types of fun with having then to machine the tops of the liners to get reduce the amount of proud metal above the block surface.

Comparing the 1976 Rolls Royce V8 with a 1976 500ci Cadillac engine in relation to the practicality of maintenance I can only summons one word to describe the Rolls Royce engine - "hideous" and I can easily describe the Cadillac engine as "practical and simplistic". However, the Rolls Royce engine does grind on you and attach itself to you in a masochistic type of a way.

However, given the decking down and the thickness of new cylinder head gaskets I am going to take a risk with this and slap the engine together hopefully sometime in the next year. Also, I might add that after much experimentation I found petrol to be by far the best thing with a paint brush to remove the oily gunk on both the outside and inside of the engine. The other fancy spray can cleaners proved themselves to be useless novelties. Petrol (gas for our USA collegues) stinks to high heaven but gets the job done and unlike steam cleaning leaves no water residue to start corroding much loved metal parts.

Additionally, I came across this little gem for washing clean fiddly little things like the head stud nuts and washers which I call the "coffee can" method. Get a coffee can, put nuts and washers inside with petrol covering all contents, affix lid and shake from side to side and not from top to bottom unless you wish to bath in petrol because the nuts and washers will punch the lid off. The result is amazing and yet so simple.

In the next few weeks I have to journey from my haunt and get work to pay for my new man cave a 30m by 18m by 5.5m American Barn style garage so the Camargue's engine rebuild will have to wait perhaps another year.

As an aside, let me just say that I feel very comfortable not having sent these cylinder heads in to a "specialist engineer" to get them decked and one of the reasons is because these days the engineers are very used to whipping off 10 thou of metal without a second thought and if you do that to a Rolls head then you are inviting an expedition into more modifications and perhaps a world of financial pain.

Admittedly, having been in the mechanical trade for 40 plus years and seeing the countless f%#kups that have occurred from many a specialist I reside in a permanent state of paranoia when it comes to anybody going near this car other than myself, especially at this point in time when the Australian economy is in a hallucinating state of denial that the economy has been well and truly croaked for the foreseeable future
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richard george yeaman
Prolific User
Username: richyrich

Post Number: 275
Registered: 4-2012
Posted on Thursday, 16 April, 2015 - 07:53:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

That's some man cave Vladimir you will be able to pack all your vehicles in and have a bit of room for yourself good luck with finding a good job that the wages are high and plenty of perks.

Richard.
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bob uk
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 94.197.121.248
Posted on Thursday, 16 April, 2015 - 08:12:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I worry when others work on my car, because having been in engineering for a life time I have seen mistakes made by skilled workers. Such as went to answer phone and forgot to tighten bottom hose clip.

(Message approved by david_gore)