| Author | Message | ||
     Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 32 Registered: 4-2017 |
RE: 2002 Azure Hello to All, Need Advise, My H2O temperature gauge shows as follows: Just past the Blue/Cold area on gauge into the middle of the black, and never exceeds into the white (normal operating range) area. Oil Temp gauge has obviously a Blue/Cold starting point, then a wide range of white prior to Red/Hot. This gauge reads just past the Blue, barely into the white portion. Both stay as described even after driving at variable speeds for over an hour +. Is this normal or ?? Todd | ||
| Paul Yorke Grand Master Username: paul_yorke Post Number: 1816 Registered: 6-2006 |
Hi Todd, I'd guess first at thermostat or coolant transmitter. Transmitter is cheaper but more fiddly. Oil temp very rarely rises tbh. Monitor the coolant temperature.  Good luck. | ||
| Omar M. Shams Grand Master Username: omar Post Number: 1204 Registered: 4-2009 |
Paul is bang on (as always) | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 33 Registered: 4-2017 |
Thx Paul & Omar, I'll do my due diligence. I assume the H2O temp should be around 200/220 degrees F ? I totally understand how the stat works, or for that matter not working. The coolant transmitter is a new ballgame. Is the CT only electrical sending false signals to the temp gauge ? Therefore the H2O actual temp would be higher. On one other subject regarding the AC & Heat controls. Blows cold and hot, however only from the windshield defroster areas. Nothing from dash vents. I do understand as per my owners manual how to switch between defroster to the dash vents by using the RH control screen facia switch. Any ideas ? Thank You, Todd | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 34 Registered: 4-2017 |
OK,,Now understand CT as per above. Awaiting repair & shop manuals...Many Thx, Todd | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 2312 Registered: 6-2009 |
Todd, You are correct about the rough range where your temperature will top out if you've been driving until the car is thoroughly hot in "not cold" weather. If it's really cold you'll be nearer the 200 degree F mark while if the ambient temperature is hot you'll be more toward the 220 degree F mark. You should acquire an IR thermometer and take your temperature at the thermostat housing and in the same spot and from approximately the same distance from that spot each time. It will stay "cold" until the thermostat opens, at which point here will be a sudden rise in temperature. You can feel it in the top radiator hose very easily as well when the thermostat opens, but a bit more slowly since rubber is a much better insulator than the metal of the thermostat housing. If you're getting readings that are within normal limits I would not worry about the gauge too much, but would pursue getting to the root of why it's not reading correctly, which I'd suspect to be the coolant temperature sender if the thermostat is working as it should. The coolant temperature sender is a thermistor that has a resistance that varies with temperature. If that thermistor is not working correctly it's impossible to venture the exact nature of the failure mode other than most times you see a low reading. I'm sure that someone has had one fail such that it reads excessively high, though. The gauge itself can fail, but that's a rare occurrence compared to temperature sender failure. Brian Addendum: The same principle applies with regard to any temperature sensor/sender. It's the resistance profile based upon the temperature range it's intended to be sensitive to that changes. | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 35 Registered: 4-2017 |
Dear Brian, Your dissertation as always mucho appreciated ! I will watch it closely and figure out which way to proceed. I was somewhat concerned that she wasn't running hot enough to burn all carbons etc. Our weather continues to be on the cool side. Should go from Winter to Summer nxt week. Thank You and many Thx to all that responded. Best, Todd | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 36 Registered: 4-2017 |
RE: Diagnostic Socket Located within Glove Box Area; Hi Again, Would an OBD II Reader be compatible ? Perhaps that device may pin-point my coolant/gauge issue's ?? Todd | ||
| Jeff Young Grand Master Username: jeyjey Post Number: 351 Registered: 10-2010 |
Hi Todd, An OBD II reader will be compatible, but will only give you emissions-related diagnostics (which are standardised). Most other stuff is sadly still manufacturer-specific. Cheers, Jeff. | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 2315 Registered: 6-2009 |
Jeff, While you are correct that there remain lots of manufacturer specific codes, what is available from the core set of codes that all manufacturers use goes very well beyond emissions. The entire range of P-codes (Powertrain) is part of the OBD-II standard and I don't know of a single manufacturer not using these. Even the P1 codes, which are manufacturer specific in meaning, must be readable by any OBD-II compliant reeader. The P-codes are the heart and soul of the entire system. https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials/getting-started-with-obd-ii https://www.obd-codes.com/trouble_codes/ Brian | ||
| Jeff Young Grand Master Username: jeyjey Post Number: 352 Registered: 10-2010 |
Hi Brian, I would argue that those are there because they affect emissions (i.e.: a misfire dumps a bunch of un-burnt hydrocarbons down the tailpipe). But you are correct that you can find out a lot about the powertrain from an OBD-II reader, which perhaps my comment was misleading on. Cheers, Jeff. | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 37 Registered: 4-2017 |
Jeff & Brian, So will an OBD II help in my situation or stick to Brian & Paul's advise as per above that seems much easier. Todd | ||
| Omar M. Shams Grand Master Username: omar Post Number: 1205 Registered: 4-2009 |
on this occasion Todd - the OBD II reader will be of no use to you. | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 38 Registered: 4-2017 |
Dear Omar, Great advise, as will save me a lot of time fiddling around and not accomplishing nada. T/Y, Todd PS: Any advise on my dash vents not blowing any air as per 4th post above..."On Another Subject" ?? OR anyone else pls chime in. Thx | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 2316 Registered: 6-2009 |
Todd, Yes, Omar and anyone else telling you that an OBD reader will be of no use for this particular problem is 100% correct. Jeff, If what I said came across as harsh it wasn't meant to be so. Most people think of emissions very narrowly. You can get a huge amount of information that goes well beyond that arena if you have a reader and a vehicle that both conform to the OBD-II spec. Now that it's been extended to ABS and Transmission codes you can even get readers that will pull those, but, of course, they're only there to pull if a car was set up such that these are monitored via OBD-II. Many weren't. Brian | ||
| Omar M. Shams Grand Master Username: omar Post Number: 1206 Registered: 4-2009 |
there are two chrome switches. The right hand one is the one that you need to focus on. This switch sometimes goes wrong. It has a center position and positions either side of that. the left position is a fixed one but the right position is supposed to be spring loaded. Lots of these cars have switches that have been forced and are therefore not in good shape (F"*ked). maybe yours is like that. The idea is to allow the switch make a momentary connection to the right of top dead centre and then see if that gives you air coming from the vents. oh - make sure the blowers are on and the ac is working when you do that. Good luck. Omar | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 39 Registered: 4-2017 |
Omar, Right position is indeed "Spring Loaded" All operation instructions are within my new Owners Manual that came from Crew. I followed them to a "T" and understand how the system should perform. With that said, The problem I'm having may be in the right chrome switch. Looking at it at this point I have now idea as to how to get at it possibly to clean the contacts. Appears the dash needs to be disassembled one way or another. I tried gently pulling on the switch, however did not release....Thx, Todd | ||
| Omar M. Shams Grand Master Username: omar Post Number: 1207 Registered: 4-2009 |
Dear Todd, Have you tried cycling the switch a few times? (whilst the ac is on and the fans blowing) I think the chrome knobs are secured in place with very small allen screws. You will need very thin allen keys to get them off. | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 40 Registered: 4-2017 |
Yes Sir....Did that several times. Will chk-out the allen screws. I originally thought this switch would eventually correct itself. Same as the "Horn Buttons". When 1st starting out they don't work, and after a 1/4 mile they function as should. Always something Ha Ha Todd PS: Something like this occurring with my e-type...sometimes/most of the time I take whatever apart and shoot it with a couple squirts of WD-40 and all is well. | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 2317 Registered: 6-2009 |
Todd, One thing you could try, whether you get the switch out (which would be better) or not, is giving it a hit with something like Caig DeOxIt or Radio Shack TV Tuner Cleaner (also made by Caig). I've got both and have used both. They can work wonders on switches suffering from light oxidation from lack of use and it's not always necessary to take anything out/apart if you can get a shot or seepage into the interior of the switch without doing so. Brian | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 41 Registered: 4-2017 |
Brian, I'll get on it this weekend. Thx so much !! No radio shack here in the hinterlands....however may be one 50 miles from me. In any case, can always buy online...it'll get accomplished. Again, T/Y Todd | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 42 Registered: 4-2017 |
Brian, I did manage to give it a hit with like product. Still the same. Will continue with more options and hopefully eventually will find the correct avenue to right the problem. AND on the Gauges...I just received my IR thermometer today. Will chk it out tomorrow as per your instructions. Seems to be a few more things not working, however not monumental. 1. All automatic switches Both drivers and passenger seats work as should except for the forward and reverse movement. Motor whirs, however no movement. 2. The manual backrest seat release along with front seats traverse switches inoperable. It may have something to do with "memory" control. Is their a way to erase MC ? Nothing within owners manual. The above two items didn't work from the get go prior to me installing a new battery. Which leads me too ask if by chance I need to have reset with a scan tool..."relearn procedure" which may actually aid in the righting of the HVAC system. Just a WAG ??? My previous MB's had identical AC controls. If I had similar circumstances, all that needed to be performed was to turn the ignition key on/off without cranking and would right the problem. BTW, I did remove fuse's pertaining to all the above and reinstalled with no luck. Oh well could be worse Todd | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 43 Registered: 4-2017 |
Other things to repair HVAC...Perhaps there is a bad air control door motor that's not allowing the dash vents to operate correctly or a bad interior temp sensor, if in fact these would be applicable...Todd | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 2327 Registered: 6-2009 |
Todd, One thing to remember is that you're dealing with a car that's from the era where it's a computer on wheels, with systems multiplexed, and that have a lot of capacitors spread throughout. If you want a "complete reset" (and there may be other issues that could crop up, and others can speak to that far better than I) you often have to remove all battery power for a span of time that's at least several hours long or longer. When I needed to "reset" my Jaguar, which could get occasional "really interesting" behaviors like the driver's side window switch on the driver's 4-switch panel operating the rear passenger side window, I would disconnect the battery for at least several hours, often overnight. If you are ever going to come close to DIY maintenance on your car you will eventually have to bite the bullet and learn how to use the Integrated Electronic Technical Information System (IETIS) to find information. Things such as those "turn start key three times - press button X - hit horn once - then dance in front of the car" type bits can be found there. It takes a while to learn how to search, and part of the problem is figuring out what the British call things, but you eventually become proficient. Brian | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 44 Registered: 4-2017 |
Brian, Great advise !! Will see where this journey takes me. I've got the dancing in front of the car down. Now I shall work on the rest. Thx for your immediate response. Regardless of all these fiddle-de-de minuscule things going on, I am truly enjoying her, and driving as a daily driver. My 2014 Escalade is much cushier, however there is something about cruising in The "B". I have the only Bentley registered in "Grand County". She's a real head turner. Be Well, Todd | ||
| Jeff Young Grand Master Username: jeyjey Post Number: 355 Registered: 10-2010 |
Hi Todd, I'd also suspect a bad "air control door motor". (Bentley calls these "servos".) On my T2, I had one of the rods seize from rust, and then the servo motor bent it a few times until it broke (at which time I became aware of it). I had another fail on my Arnage; this time it was the servo motor itself. If the motor whirrs and the seat doesn't move, then I don't think it's the memory control unit. More likely the seat frame is binding, or your clutches are stripped. Do the seat cushions lift straight out like on the earlier Shadows, or are the later ones more like the Arnage? The Shadows had a single motor per seat with multiple clutches, while the Arnage has multiple motors. Cheers, Jeff. | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 45 Registered: 4-2017 |
Hi Jeff, Thank you for your input. I don't believe the seats lift out. After further investigating, I managed to make the drivers seat go all the way forward with the manual backrest release, however it wouldn't reverse. I pushed memory 2 and it reversed. At least we know it's not binding etc. Gotta be something electrical. I'll eventually figure it out as it's know doubt something easy, ha ha ! I spoke with the previous owner. He reiterated that the HVAC worked as should when he traded for a 2016 Arnage in July 2016. I do get cold and or hot air blowing through the defroster vents. Will keep on it when time permits. I recall after receiving the car via transport the battery was pretty much depleted (shot) and wouldn't hold a charge. The car sat for 3 days with the battery totally disconnected prior to installing a new one. If and when I get to the bottom of this. I will post the outcome. Again, Many Thx, Todd | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 46 Registered: 4-2017 |
IR Thermometer shows correct temperature of 220 F after engine warms up. Seats are working as should after a few quick motions on the manual control along with several pushes on the auto return button. Same with lumbar supports. Received my CTEC 700 battery maintenance float charger. What a dream that is to own. This car came from West Palm Beach Florida. Always garaged, however perhaps being in the salt-air climate for 15 yrs may have had an impact on the several issues I experienced. Again, WAG... Thx Again Guys for all your vast knowledge & support. Much appreciated !! Todd | ||
| Jeff Young Grand Master Username: jeyjey Post Number: 356 Registered: 10-2010 |
Hi Todd, Just had the dealer look at the front passenger seat on my Arnage (which would only go about 1/2 the way back). They pulled it out and said the frame was a bit warped/bent which was fouling the tracks. A new frame was a rather prohibitive £1600, so we went with just manually moving the seat all the way to the back of the tracks before re-installing. Of course, now it works fine (moving both front and back on the motors). Anyway, in your case I'd suspect hardened grease with a bit of carpet fuzz in it for good measure, rather than salt-air-inspired corrosion. Certainly giving them a work-out from time to time is a good idea. Cheers, Jeff. | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 48 Registered: 4-2017 |
Jeff, Thank you for your indication that the track may have a bit of obstruction as you described. Will check it out. Todd | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 2333 Registered: 6-2009 |
As a generic observation: If it moves occasionally make it move. Run all windows up and down, seats fore/aft | tilt fore/aft | etc, locks exercised via fob & door switches. In the case of convertibles/DHCs top up and down, etc., etc., etc. Nothing kills electromechanical systems like disuse does. Nothing on these cars generally wears out, but instead dies of disuse. | ||
| Todd Keleske Experienced User Username: toddk Post Number: 49 Registered: 4-2017 |
Brian, All good points. I wouldn't have thought to do so. Will put her through the paces. Previous owner said he was the only driver, and never moved the seats etc...so there you go. Now, only occasionally the auto-ride displays a few seconds just after in gear and proceeding to drive. Then goes away. I've sat on the rear with trunk open. AR didn't respond with my 195 lbs . Perhaps it needs another 200 lbs to respond. Will try that ... Thank you, Todd | ||
| Maxwell Heazlewood Frequent User Username: tasbent Post Number: 64 Registered: 9-2017 |
Todd...quite often it's easiest to check engine temps by using and infrared temp. sensor gun. You can check various areas of the engine with one of these hand held units. Is the car used regularly and does it attain normal running temps.? | ||
| Todd Keleske Frequent User Username: toddk Post Number: 51 Registered: 4-2017 |
Hello Max, Thank you for your follow-up. I did take Brian Vogel's advise as per his comment above and did just that regarding an IRTG. My engine is in fact operating at the normal temperature as should. Have yet to investigate any further. Could be within the electronics or whatever. Happy Motoring, Todd PS: Also used the IRTG to check my Jag's carburetors regarding possible fuel boiling over, as Ethanol Fuel boils at approx 212 F. During hot Summer days that is possible within the Jag's engine bay after shutting the engine down...."Heat Soaking" which I experienced. I switched to Non E fuel, and that solved the issue. | ||
| Jim Walters Prolific User Username: jim_walters Post Number: 125 Registered: 1-2014 |
Todd, Auto Ride is totally independent of the height control system. Auto Ride only switches the damper settings while you are driving. Height control lifts the rear to compensate for weight in the trunk. SRH8505 SRC18015 SRE22493 NAC-05370 www.bristolmotors.com | ||
| Maxwell Heazlewood Frequent User Username: tasbent Post Number: 66 Registered: 9-2017 |
Greetings Todd....yes, the old adage applies to many things in this regard...."Use it or loose it" ;o) In regards to your gauges....bare in mind that these gauges are only really fancy 'idiot' lights. Gone are the days of effective calibrated gauges, they became just too expensive for the bean counters to contemplate ;o) If you check your wiring diagrams and find where most of the earth connections are and give them a good clean, it's amazing how many 'problems' it solves. Keeping your batteries well charged is of prime importance on all modern cars with a plethora of electronics which induce a permanent quiescent drain on voltage. Regards your fuel 'boiling'....nasty stuff ethanol fuels...luckily we are not infested with he stuff here much...there are a few station that sell E10....to be avoid like the plague for pre 2000 cars as there fuel systems are not designed to handle the rigors of ethanol laced fuels. Keeping the carbs clean and well synced plus it also works to advantage to advance your ignition a couple of degrees. I hope you are using electronic ignition? The use of a good quality upper cyl. lubricant in older cars is advisable as modern fuels do not contain the 'lubricity' of good old fashioned leaded fuels. | ||
| Maxwell Heazlewood Frequent User Username: tasbent Post Number: 67 Registered: 9-2017 |
From Todd....>>>Received my CTEC 700 battery maintenance float charger. What a dream that is to own. This car came from West Palm Beach Florida. Always garaged, however perhaps being in the salt-air climate for 15 yrs may have had an impact on the several issues I experienced. Again, WAG...>>>>> Hello Tod....contained in that statement I reckon is the root cause of most of your 'problems'. Even though the car has been under cover the atmosphere still contains an awful of corrosive elements, especially for electronics that don't get used as much as they should be. The corrosion attacks all sorts of connections building up a layer of resistance which causes all sorts of problems. As Brian stated ..."A computer on wheels"....just about covers it  | ||
| Todd Keleske Frequent User Username: toddk Post Number: 52 Registered: 4-2017 |
Hi Jim !!! Thank you for the explanation as I am still learning about this Azure. Very much appreciated. When garaged for several days the rear height drops approx 1 ". Then after a drive ascends as should. Must be a normal occurrence. I perused your "Bristol Motors" web page. Very impressive indeed!!! What a great read regarding Around The World in 80 days. Congrat's on your win within your class. I will go through it again as it's so well documented that I felt I was along for the ride. I URGE ALL TO VIEW such a fun read. Pls place me within your mailing list on News from Bristol Motors. Thx tmkkel@yahoo.com | ||
| Todd Keleske Frequent User Username: toddk Post Number: 53 Registered: 4-2017 |
Hello Maxwell, Yesss, I've been going through the electronics regarding all connections and am gaining on it. Several mynute glitches (gremlins) have been eliminated. Experienced similar circumstances when living on Maui back in the 80's. shipped over my impeccable 1970 MB 280 SEL. On that ride a wire brush did the trick...LOL On the Jag, Many of my cronies within Jag Lovers Forum have recommended switching to electronic ignition. Have yet to feel the need. So far Normal driving here in The Colorado Rockies is above 8,000'. Hence forth I leaned out the 4 Stromberg's using an EGA along with the proper ROM diagnostics and adjusting tool. Made a huge difference in performance. Have had The B and The Jag up to 140 MPH. Totally different drives, however what a hoot !!! Later, Todd | ||
| Maxwell Heazlewood Frequent User Username: tasbent Post Number: 69 Registered: 9-2017 |
Hi Todd...good to see you are getting on top of things ;o) I reckon if you change over to electronic ignition and fit NGK Iridium plugs, you will be amazed at the crisper response from these engines. Stretching the legs of these beasts to their full potential is indeed a hoot ;o)) | ||
| Todd Keleske Frequent User Username: toddk Post Number: 54 Registered: 4-2017 |
M, Heading South soon. May change out to elec ign nxt Spring. Currently running Champion Copper plugs. All is well and looking forward to the warmth of Mexico as our temp reading here this AM...14 F. Brrrr... Also admired JJ pic's within another topic, and cruising at 163 MPH...Now that's fast !! I can't recall doing that even when competing/racing SCCA circuits back in the day...Damn, makes me feel old !!! As they say "age is only a #." Take Care, Todd | ||
| Maxwell Heazlewood Frequent User Username: tasbent Post Number: 75 Registered: 9-2017 |
Hello Tod....yes, Colorado would be getting a bit chilly now. As I said....I only did it once to prove i could but never again. Racing on a track is a little different to running flat out on a deserted desert highway ;o) |
