COLD START PROBLEMS on my Mulsanne S ... Log Out | Topics | Search
Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Australian RR Forums » Spirit Series » COLD START PROBLEMS on my Mulsanne S 1992 « Previous Next »

Author Message
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
New User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 8
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Wednesday, 16 May, 2018 - 10:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I have been posting problems relating to the fact my Mulsanne S 92 has been stopped for 4 years, due to the lack of a good mechanic here in Portugal...The response from members has been FANTASTIC!

Onto what seems to be the LAST PROBLEM before the car is ready: The cold start is not working....I turn the key, and if I dont accelerate immediately (in Park that is) the car dies immediately....I must press the gas paddle for at least a minute, until car is warm, and then the idling is fantastic, and the car runs smoothly....What things should I look for? My mechanic is very good (and honest!) but he has had no experience in Bentleys before. The bentley representative here in Portugal is a "joke" and a rip-off. Thank you for your help!
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

gordon le feuvre
Prolific User
Username: triumph

Post Number: 246
Registered: 7-2012
Posted on Thursday, 17 May, 2018 - 06:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I DO NOT KNOW ANSWER, BUT FUEL INJECTION IS BOSCH, SO I WOULD LOOK FOR CLASSIC/CURRENT MERCEDES SHOP. WOULD HAVE THOUGHT LOT MORE OF THESE THAN R-R/BENTLEY
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
New User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 9
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Thursday, 17 May, 2018 - 10:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thank you Gordon! But I dont think itīs the fuel injection....Itīs a "cold start valve, I think...But not sure yet. Waiting for suggestions..
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1512
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Friday, 18 May, 2018 - 04:03 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Dear Pedro,
can you send us a photo of the engine compartment from both sides?
It could be the auxilliary air valve. This is also known as the idle control valve.
Like Gordon says, a Mercedes or BMW shop will know what to do.

have a read of this.......
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=248979
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
New User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 10
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Friday, 18 May, 2018 - 04:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Dear Omar:

Thank you very much again for your input. I just came back from the garage where the car is. Tomorrow morning I shall take those pictures and send them to you.

Warm regards

Pedro
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 12
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Monday, 21 May, 2018 - 06:31 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Omar!

I have sent you the pictures you asked for: both sides of the engine, as well as a "piece of equipment" which is directly connected to the throttle cable. The mechanic "suspects" that that piece may be the "culprit" for the cold start problems. Car starts but unless one presses the gas paddle, it will die immediately...Once it's warm it "purrs like a kitten and works very well. Either that piece or the cold start injector...What do you think?

Warm regards

Pedro

Bentley 1

bentley 2

bentley 3

.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1522
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Monday, 21 May, 2018 - 07:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

No Pedro .That is the cruise controller actuator .Ask him to put it back.

In the first photo there is a small silver item with two or three hoses connected to it and an electric connector.

It is near the oil filler cap. That is the problem.

.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 13
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Monday, 21 May, 2018 - 09:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thank you Omar!

Going to the garage immediately.

Warm regards

Pedro
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 14
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Monday, 21 May, 2018 - 09:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Omar,

Is it possible that you could point an arrow to where (approximately) that silver item with 2 or 3 hose connected and an electric connecter is?

THank you.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1524
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 12:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 15
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 01:08 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Omar, THANK YOU very much!
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1528
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 05:26 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

another possibility is the temperature sensor.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Robert J. Sprauer
Experienced User
Username: wraithman

Post Number: 31
Registered: 11-2017
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 09:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

There is a separate injector in the plenum for cold starting. If it fails to idle one must check fuel pressure first. If its ok the warm up regulator should be checked. This is a Bosch system which is reliable and easily fixed by a properly schooled mechanic. Bosch has service centers listed on their site. If your going to see Bob at the local service station you will get your car butchered and spending money on endless parts hoping the mechanic gets lucky as evidenced here.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 16
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 09:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Omar, thank you for the tip. Do you have a schematics of where the temperature sensor is located?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 17
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 09:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Robert:

Thank you for your input. You are right, I am going to "Bob the mechanic" as the portuguese Bentley dealership is a joke! But "my Bob" is honest, and an engineer, while he has never worked in Bentleys before.... Fuel pressure is OK, could you please tell me or do you have the schematics of where the warm up regulator is located?

Best Regards

Pedro
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Robert J. Sprauer
Experienced User
Username: wraithman

Post Number: 32
Registered: 11-2017
Posted on Tuesday, 22 May, 2018 - 11:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

The warmup regulator senses heat off the engine and internally adjusts resistance via a signal to the ECU to make adjustments.. Again this is a unit that should be tested by a Bosch trained technician. The unit generally has 2 lines and an electrical connector.
BTW you have checked the actual fuel pressure with a fuel pressure gauge?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jim Walters
Prolific User
Username: jim_walters

Post Number: 157
Registered: 1-2014
Posted on Wednesday, 23 May, 2018 - 03:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Pedro, your model does not have a warm up regulator. It uses an electro-hydraulic actuator (EHA)to regulate the mixture when cold. There is a test button in the fuse panel under the dash that you can use to read any fault codes that are stored in the system. I suggest you interrogate the ECU using that button to find the fault. Instructions for doing so are in the links I have attached below. It sounds like your engine ECU is in limp home mode which will make cold starting and running rough. Interrogating the ECU should tell you what part is causing the issue. You and your mechanic need to read through the following:

http://rrtechnical.info/sz/cs/tsd5069p1.pdf

http://rrtechnical.info/sz/cs/tsd5069p2.pdf

http://rrtechnical.info/sz/cs/tsd5069p3.pdf

Let us know what fault codes you find.

SRH8505 SRC18015 SRE22493 NAC-05370
www.bristolmotors.com
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 18
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Thursday, 24 May, 2018 - 03:27 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Robert:

No, actual fuel pressure was not tested. The car is running "silky smooth" at about 640 RPM, and it drives well. Itīs the starting that is giving us problems, we need to warm it up. After warming. Car starts and runs fine....And CO reading is about 0.5, which I find a little strange...It should be about 0.8 to 1.0....Either than that rear supension is very hard, but I have bought those 2 green "balls"...Just that the mechanic has had to buy a special tool as the old ones are so tight, he has not been able to screw them out....He will do it on Friday, when the tool arrives. This is so stressful....Thank you for your support!
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 19
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Thursday, 24 May, 2018 - 03:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Dear Jim:

Thank you so much for you input! And the sending of the manuals. I have now printed them all, will study them carefuly tonite, and tomorrow I am "out to pester" the mechanic....Actually, he is a very nice guy and honest, trying his hardest. The best I have found so far, the others, and especially Bentley Portugal were a joke!
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jim Walters
Prolific User
Username: jim_walters

Post Number: 158
Registered: 1-2014
Posted on Thursday, 24 May, 2018 - 03:48 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Pedro, tell your mechanic to use his air chisel to loosen the gas springs (green balls). He just needs to touch them at an angle and give them a quick "zap" and that will break them loose. I think in Tee-One Topics there will be an article with pictures on how to do this:

http://rrtechnical.info/TeeOne/teeone.htm

When you have some free time you should look through the Tee-One section for articles relevant to your car.

SRH8505 SRC18015 SRE22493 NAC-05370
www.bristolmotors.com
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 20
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Friday, 25 May, 2018 - 10:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Jim, thank you!

The mechanic has broken one of his tools (the one for unscrewing the oil filter) trying to take out those green balls from the back suspension. I just called him now, he is picking up the same tool, but for trucks! What is an "air chisel"? Is it a "chisel" that one plugs into compressed air, to "chisel away" at stone, for example? Please excuse my lack of knowledge on these things....If he "zaps" the gas springs, wont he run a risk of damaging the threads?

Warm regards

Pedro
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 21
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Friday, 25 May, 2018 - 11:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi again Jim! Just spoke to the mechanic, and this comment is just make us laugh a little!: THe tool the mechanic ordered (to take away those "green balls" was SO BIG (for trucks) it did not even fit the lugagge compartment of "Wilson"! Thatīs what I call my mulsanne. So he is getting a smaller tool. I mentioned the air Chisel, he does not have one. But he stated that he "understood" what you wrote.

They say "patience is the mother of all virtues"...But I am running out!

Warm regards

Pedro
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 22
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Saturday, 26 May, 2018 - 02:26 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

DEAR ALL: SUCESS!!!

My Mechanic just came over the house, he managed to take out the "old green balls" and install the new ones-Gas springs....The car is now ultra-confortable, as a Bentley/Rolls should be! HOWEVER, the mechanic, on trying to turn the car around on a the narrow road that lead to my home, BANGED the back against some stones...As a result, NOW i must try to find the lens....One piece of GOOD NEWS, and then this happens! Here is the picture:

Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Jim Walters
Prolific User
Username: jim_walters

Post Number: 159
Registered: 1-2014
Posted on Saturday, 26 May, 2018 - 04:03 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Pedro, sad to see that broken light.
I thought I had mentioned to you the need for a chain wrench for removing the gas springs but it was a post on another forum. Again, I suggest you read through the Tee-One Topics for relevant articles on your model (SZ is the model designation). Page 737 in issue 50: http://rrtechnical.info/TeeOne/TO50.pdf shows the chain wrench for the next time you replace the gas springs or brake accumulator spheres.
Have you had a chance to interrogate the ECU for fault codes?

SRH8505 SRC18015 SRE22493 NAC-05370
www.bristolmotors.com
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

Pedro Gomes
Experienced User
Username: portamno

Post Number: 23
Registered: 2-2018
Posted on Saturday, 26 May, 2018 - 04:30 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Jim!

Thank you for your reply. No, we hve not checked for faulty codes yet. This will be done next week. Now, gotta look for L/H tail lamp lenses, which is frustrating to say the least....

Thank you for the marvellous links you have sent!

Warm regards

Pedro

Add Your Message Here
Post:
Bold text Italics Underline Create a hyperlink Insert a clipart image

Username: Posting Information:
This is a public posting area. Enter your username and password if you have an account. Otherwise, enter your full name as your username and leave the password blank. Your e-mail address is optional.
Please quote Chassis Numbers for all vehicles mentioned.
Password:
E-mail:
Options: Enable HTML code in message
Automatically activate URLs in message
Action: