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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 202
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Sunday, 01 April, 2018 - 05:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

What ho chaps, actually using the BGD for a change (it's done about 1000 miles in 2.5 years!)and as you all suggested, it is feeling better to drive every day, though I'm not sure she appreciates being out in the rain...

Anyway, battery. Do these cars have any kind of 'smart charging' system? I had a new battery about 2 years ago and I have never felt that the battery had much in reserve, if the doors were left open for any length of time, the car wouldn't start as the battery was too low, I mean about 15 minutes. So I think I will get another battery (or rather, take this one back to the supplier and whinge as only a 'Pom' can :-) ) but what is the biggest battery/CCA etc I can fit? It's a 98 Brooklands 'R' (66221). I also note that when the battery is low, I get loads of spurious 'fault' warning on the DIP and that is when the rev counter starts to play sill beggers.
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richard george yeaman
Grand Master
Username: richyrich

Post Number: 952
Registered: 4-2012
Posted on Sunday, 01 April, 2018 - 06:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi David the batteries in these cars are definitely under powered in the battery department and what makes matters worse is that the positive side of the battery is on the left hand side, also the compartment where the beastly thing resides is small in length and width and also quite deep, I have fitted two new batteries to my car a turbo R in the just three years and a bit hat I have owned the car, I carry a spare battery and a set of jump leads I too would be interested in a solution, Also if the immobiliser isn't switched off the battery dies quickly.

Richard.
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 203
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Sunday, 01 April, 2018 - 06:51 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thanks Richard.It does seem to go down rapidly and when it is low, the spurious warnings are annoying. Yes, they go down pretty quickly (within seconds, but still...). I shall investigate and if a solution is found, I'll let you know.

David
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 163
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Sunday, 01 April, 2018 - 01:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

The old battery saga rears it's ugly head again.....
NEVER skimp on cheap batteries for these cars!
Like all modern electronically loaded cars, they rely heavily on a well charged healthy battery.
it's recommended to fit the biggest and best Silver Calcium battery you can get and keep the bloody thing on a proper six stage automatic charger of at least 16 amps capacity....it's a waste of time and energy to use those pissy little trickle chargers and expect to maintain a healthy battery!
Especially given that most of these cars use short infrequent trips and there is a strong demand on the battery.
Not forgetting that these cars along with most modern cars have a quiescent discharge even when the car is turned off to keep alive on board systems.
Case in point....my 1998 Jaguar XJ8 uses a Varta
100A/Hr 880CCA Silver Calcium battery that is now 12 years old and in full operational health because it is kept on the automatic charger when not in use through a simple 'pigtail' connection
in the boot.
Once a month I put the battery through the full
de-sulphation phase of the charger to maximize the battery health and I never have any problems starting or running.
Modern cars hate to have below par batteries that will trigger all sorts of spurious warnings and strange habits because the electrical charge is so
interdependent for everything that operates.
Do yourself and you car a favour, buy the biggest and best battery available along with a good quality 6 stage automatic charger, set up an pigtil connection to your battery for easy connection of the charger and end all this saga and stop blaming your car....it's simple really.
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 766
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Sunday, 01 April, 2018 - 05:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

My own anecdotal experience is that it is never a bad idea to use an external maintenance charger. Anything is preferable to nothing.

I have had excellent results with the Battery Tender brand which is usually about $30 and provides a monitored and controlled (automatic) 750milliamp charge which is sufficient to counteract the tendency of a battery to loose charge over time and will quite rapidly fully top up a battery that has been used at night, with heater fans on, et cetera and parked before the alternator has brought it back up within hours, or by the next day at the most.

That said, it is essential to maintain a full charge on a battery from new and never allow it to become so fully discharged that it cannot start the vehicle. My experience has been that once that happens, its capacity to hold a charge never recovers beyond perhaps 80% (my guess) of its prior capacity. You only have to do that a few times and 80% of 80% of 80%, et cetera, means that run it flat just a few times and you have successfully ruined the battery's ability to both hold a charge and more especially, its CCA capacity. Usually a symptom of fatal damage is the inability to hold a charge even overnight and even with noting connected.

Accordingly, were it me, I would first test the battery by charging fully externally and then with positive terminal disconnected, or isolation switch in "off" position, see how long it will hold a charge. If it is noticeably flat in just a day or two...or worse, overnight, the battery is trash.

.
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Darryl Watson
Frequent User
Username: inox

Post Number: 55
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Sunday, 01 April, 2018 - 05:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi,
I go along with using a Varta. I fitted a Varta Blue 063 in April 2012. The previous "run of the mill" battery lasted three years.
I connect a battery conditioner when the car is not in use and the car is only used for a few thousand miles each year.
(Suppose the battery will fail now that I've posted this)
Regards
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 204
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Monday, 02 April, 2018 - 12:04 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

The battery on it is a Varta and bigger than standard but I think it had been in stock for a while when I bought it judging by the speed with which the seller offered a discount!

It is all definitely battery related though: now it is charged again, all the faults have gone and the rev counter is behaving again. I shall look at batteries on Tuesday, any suggestions as to precise model?
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 164
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Monday, 02 April, 2018 - 11:42 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David, check out Varta's web site for a specific battery and get the highest amperage that will fit in the space.
Be thankful you don't have an Arnage with two batteries to worry about ;o)=)
What amp rating is your charger?
These small trickle chargers are less than useless
as they create a surface charge instead of a full deep charge.
Check all your battery cables and make sure your earths are clean and secure and coat with di-electric grease to prevent corrosion which is the most common problem to exposed wiring.
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 165
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Monday, 02 April, 2018 - 12:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David....I don't think it's the battery's fault it's the lack of use!
1500 in two years??
According to Varta's site the Blue Dynamic is listed for your car but is on;y 70 a/hr.
The dimensions are:
Width:175 mm
Length:261 mm
Height:220 mm


https://www.varta-automotive.com/en-gb/products/varta-blue-dynamic/570-413-063

If you can find a silver to fit the space go for it.
This is the one to go for if it will fit lengthwise:

https://www.varta-automotive.com/en-gb/products/varta-silver-dynamic/577-400-078

I'm really annoyed that such an expensive car had a crappy battery arrangement.

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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 205
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Monday, 02 April, 2018 - 08:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I 'think' the battery I have is a silver... Oh hum. The thing is: they don't seem to need a huge amount of juice to start but the battery doesn't seem to have any reserve. I am pretty sure that my battery is dying, going to go and get it tested tomorrow, I shall go back to the place I bought it from ad try and blag a new one :-)
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michael vass
Grand Master
Username: mikebentleyturbo2

Post Number: 448
Registered: 7-2015
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 02:43 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi David
I'm sure the alternator is not smart but it can put out 140A which could cook a battery if not big and tough, the original is 70A/h ok
Mike
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 166
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 10:14 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Michael....the alternator has a built in regulation system to prevent this.
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John Kilkenny
Prolific User
Username: john_kilkenny

Post Number: 276
Registered: 6-2005
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 11:04 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

All batteries will self discharge over time. A lead acid car battery will lose about 5 percent of charge each month. Because our cars are generally used intermittently it makes sense to prolong battery life by keeping a smart charger connected. This type of charger monitors the battery voltage and adjusts the charging current to maintain a full charge of around 13.5 volt.
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Martyn Grattage
Frequent User
Username: martyngrattage

Post Number: 70
Registered: 11-2017
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 03:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi All

I can't believe lead acid batteries are still or were used for Rubber Tyres or Internal Combustion Engine..!!

I bought a Pretty Basic PowerAll Deluxe for Christmas - light and the weight of a small router. I have two babies with batteries and alternator issues.

Lithium Ion Batteries are now the things for tools and phones - but not cars.

Both device i I have used many times successfully

I now have one with usb ports and bluetooth speaker.

Have a look at the kind of spec below.

I suggest you have a Google and find whatever fits your requirements whet your whistle.

Battery Type: Lithium Ion
Battery Capacity: 16,000mAh
Watt Hours: 60Wh
Peak Amps: 1000A
Jump Start Capacity: 10.0L Engine
Vehicles: 12 Volt (4-8 Cylinder)
Lifespan: 1,000 Life Cycles
Standby: 6-12 Months
USB Outputs: 2x 5V/2.1A
LED Flashlight w/Multi-Modes: Flashlight, Strobe Light, SOS Emergency Flash
SOS Emergency Flash up to 100,000 Hours
90 Lumens x2
Water Resistant IP54 Rated
Voltage Feedback Protection w/MOSFETs
Reverse Polarity and Spark Proof Protection
Overload Protection
Over-Current Protection
Short Circuit Protection
Over Voltage Protection
Over Charge Protection
Dimensions: 6.7x3.1x1.25
Weight: 14 oz.

Martyn Grattage
0401661077
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Christian S. Hansen
Grand Master
Username: enquiring_mind

Post Number: 767
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 04:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Martyn...
"Pretty Basic" PowerAll "Deluxe" sounds like an oxymoron...you know...like "Jumbo Shrimp", etc...
That said, I have been curious about these new fangled very small size emergency jump starters and would like to determine if they really are practical to have to jump start a full sized car engine...as they are allegedly (if you believe their advertising!) capable of doing. Seems to me that they were discussed briefly in a recent (past six months) thread here but cannot find it. What feedback or referrals can other members provide?

.
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Paul Yorke
Grand Master
Username: paul_yorke

Post Number: 2041
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 05:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Modern Engine Management Units have under and over voltage PROTECTION built in.

A low battery voltage and the ECM turns off the crank signal.

The battery is not usually flat flat.... and this is very different to a non ECM RR&B with a properly flat battery.

Raising the battery voltage allows makes the ECM think everything is fine so it turns off the important safety protection which then allows the crank signal even the the battery is low.

Use a maintainence charger. If you do not have mains power then disconnect a battery terminal as a last resort.

The interior lights are numerous on a 98 car (12 mayne) so will eat batteries pretty quickly especially if the car has been standing for a while. Start the car as soon as you get to it.

Another warning if you take the battery to be tested. Modern digital testers do not "load" the battery like the old hot metal element type do so false "OK' results are frequent.

Regular use of these cars is an advantage but not on salty roads. Enjoy her 😁
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michael vass
Grand Master
Username: mikebentleyturbo2

Post Number: 449
Registered: 7-2015
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 06:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Maxwell, no it doesn't, it only has a voltage regulator.Too small a battery and 140A will cook it ok
Mike
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Rowland Palmer
Experienced User
Username: rowland

Post Number: 23
Registered: 12-2016
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 06:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Just had my battery fail. Not sure how old it was 70amp CCA700. Have got the same type again. Also purchased a solar 12 V charger and have hooked that up, when the RR is not in use. We will see what happens. Mind you I live in Australia so the batteries don't get a hiding.
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 206
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Tuesday, 03 April, 2018 - 08:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I have a VERY small self starter type emergency battery thing, it is the size of a book (hardback). A friend bought it for me for storing his stuff for 6 months. I was dubious to say the least... but, it does start a Bentley with a flat battery! No problem at all.
It was quite expensive (for him) at about 140 but seems fantastic and fits in behind the false wall in the boot between the amps and the phone stuff.

I am als noticing that usig the car is proving very advantageous in-so-much as the car is running much more happily. I'm not happy that she is sat outside in the constant rain we are having but I want to get rid of the garage I have so I need to use her more. A 20 year old Bentley as a 'daily driver' has got to be a recipe for disaster... right?

:-)
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Jonas TRACHSEL
Prolific User
Username: jonas_trachsel

Post Number: 167
Registered: 2-2005
Posted on Wednesday, 04 April, 2018 - 04:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Quote: A 20 year old Bentley as a 'daily driver' has got to be a recipe for disaster... right?
David, may I disagree? Once properly serviced and all bugs from very infrequent usage sorted, these cars will be tremendous daily drivers, giving endless pleasure. They are good for several hundred thousand miles.
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Omar M. Shams
Grand Master
Username: omar

Post Number: 1452
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Thursday, 05 April, 2018 - 04:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I have used my 96 Azure every single day since September 2017. I put my cars away for the scorching summer and use modern cars for 3 months of the year but the rest of the time...... these cars run fine as daily drivers. I agree totally with Jonas.
Thanks
Omar
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 208
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Monday, 16 April, 2018 - 09:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I think I 'may' have found out why I have been having battery problems. I noticed that it was worse in the rain and traffic so, lights, wipers and air con all going hard. The other day (wet so all of the above on) I pulled up outside a shop and opened the door before killing the engine and heard the most hideous squeeling... yes the dreaded loose fan belt. I wodered whose it was 'cos it couldn't be mine as ALL the belts were renewed 2-300 miles ago at the last service (at vast expense I might add), but it was!

Today I finally got a chance to have a look and the fan belt to the alternator is looser than a 3 inch nut on a toothpick! So were the other two belts that I could see/reach (I can't bend, my back no longer does what backs are supposed to do!). 17mm and 11mm sockets and the work of a moment and the belts are properly adjusted! Not impressed with the last service the old girl received, rad cap left loose on the expansion tank causing water loss and a panic stricken owner, tyres massively under inflated under filled with oil....
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 171
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Monday, 16 April, 2018 - 10:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David....you were lucky to find out what was the cause!
Who the hell was the grease monkey who serviced your car?
I would be tearing strips of the sods!
No doubt they charged you a premium?
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 209
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Tuesday, 17 April, 2018 - 12:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

The same guys I have used since I got the car, Craig the chief mechanic was always ace and seemed to do a first rate job but, because they have become so busy they have taken on a nother chap as well, it was he who serviced my car last. Not impressed in the slightest.

Premium? At a specialist RR and B dealer? Never! :-)
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 172
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Tuesday, 17 April, 2018 - 11:17 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

That situation David, I'm afraid is indicative of a lot of service centres these days.
And will remain so unless you're willing to pay
specialist centres premium prices for a 20 year old car it won't change.
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 210
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Tuesday, 17 April, 2018 - 08:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

That's the point though, I DO pay specialist service centre prices! The car has never gone anywhere but to the only local RRandB specialists and they do charge accordingly. They rebuilt all the front suspension, the brakes, the steering, most of the electrics the list is nearly endless and I have spent 20K with them over the last 2 years. It's first service in my ownership was 10693.13 and it hasn't stopped there! To receive this shoddy treatment is slightly galling.
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Colin Salmon
New User
Username: spurfatherfigure

Post Number: 3
Registered: 3-2018
Posted on Wednesday, 18 April, 2018 - 12:40 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I have the batteries on my several cars connected to a 'floating charger' when not in DD use. OK, I have spent a lot on C-Tec but I have no problems.
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Paul Yorke
Grand Master
Username: paul_yorke

Post Number: 2049
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Wednesday, 18 April, 2018 - 01:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

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Mark Luft
Prolific User
Username: bentleyman1993

Post Number: 178
Registered: 10-2016
Posted on Wednesday, 18 April, 2018 - 04:42 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David, be sure to let the garage owner know what happened. If it's the new guy, then the owner can make adjustments. Either by watching what TNG does and following up with customers, or cutting him loose. We pay a premium to keep our cars running, we should get premium service and repairs. My local shop is reasonable, at least compared to a new car dealer (any brand).
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 211
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Wednesday, 18 April, 2018 - 07:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Good advice Mark, but I don't like complaining! I usually vote with my feet and use someone else but there is no one else round here!

Also I was very happy with the service before this, so... what to do?
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Darryl Watson
Frequent User
Username: inox

Post Number: 58
Registered: 4-2015
Posted on Wednesday, 18 April, 2018 - 07:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Complain.
Politely but firmly.
Its your money that you have spent.
If no result forward the correspondence to the Managing Director / CEO. That usually, but not always, works.
Regards
Darryl
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Paul Yorke
Grand Master
Username: paul_yorke

Post Number: 2051
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Wednesday, 18 April, 2018 - 07:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Complain, see what they have to say. If fact don't "complain" - just phone up with some feedback! If you don't tell the garage how can they improve?

Negotiate a discount and insist the chief technician does your car next time.

Suggest that the top guy also inspects any cars the trainee does before releasing them.

It is tricky training new guys but if they don't get trained the knowledge will be lost completely! If the new guy doesn't get corrected straight away the bad habits will stay with them.

(New fan belts always need tightening up after a while. We fit, run, test drive and then re-tighten. They will still need tightening up again after a few months though.)
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 177
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Wednesday, 18 April, 2018 - 09:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David, I agree with the others.
You have a reasonable rapour with the gent so, I would approach and discuss the situation in a gentlemanly manner as RR and Bentley owners do
and I'm sure he would do something about it.
Of course you have the powers of veto and can spread
the word that his business is not to be trusted.
Nobody likes bad press.
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 212
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Thursday, 19 April, 2018 - 12:31 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I hae taken your advice and written an e-mail to the boss (I always use e-mail). I wasn't rude or harsh or even particularly negative I just pointed out the various errors in the servicing and suggested it was not to their usual high standards. In fact, I used the words 'heads up'.

I have had the car out today and for a change it is glorious weather (freezing cold and raining yesterday!) so air con on high and sat in loads of traffic jams as everyone is out in Torbay enjoying the sunshine and not a hint of belt squeel or erratic gauges/warnings. So it would seem that weeks of worry and dithering about getting the gauges repaired at 800 plus VAT was simply down to a loose fan belt!
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Paul Yorke
Grand Master
Username: paul_yorke

Post Number: 2053
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Thursday, 19 April, 2018 - 12:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Sunny days and a happy car.

Perfect.

If only all the other drivers would stay at home.
!
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Mark Luft
Prolific User
Username: bentleyman1993

Post Number: 180
Registered: 10-2016
Posted on Thursday, 19 April, 2018 - 07:16 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 178
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Thursday, 19 April, 2018 - 11:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David, now you can enjoy your lovely motor.
Get it out there and put a few decent miles on it
100 out and a 100 back...give the car a good airing literally....make sure you turn the heater on full a couple of times to properly circulate coolant.
It's amazing how moisture will build up in the weirdest places in the body cavities including the exhaust system.
Remember, you're driving behind 6.75 ltrs of big V8 and it needs a good run to warm it through and the gearbox and diff and dry out thoroughly the exhaust system.....you car will thank you for it
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David Towers
Prolific User
Username: xtriple

Post Number: 213
Registered: 6-2010
Posted on Thursday, 19 April, 2018 - 07:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Will do :-)

Want to lend me the money for the fuel?

:-) :-)

Got a reply from the boss and it's left me strangely disatisfied. Very non-commital and glossed over the faults I pointed out. Ho hum...
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 179
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Thursday, 19 April, 2018 - 08:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

David....man in your position, the cost if fuel is least of your worries ;o)
Get out there and enjoy giving your car a well deserved thrashing!
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Maxwell Heazlewood
Prolific User
Username: tasbent

Post Number: 180
Registered: 9-2017
Posted on Thursday, 19 April, 2018 - 08:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

...>>>> Got a reply from the boss and it's left me strangely dissatisfied. Very non-committal and glossed over the faults I pointed out. Ho hum...>>>>

Well, like i said you have the alternative and it's time to put that into operation!

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