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Roderick Waite
Frequent User
Username: rodwaite

Post Number: 54
Registered: 1-2012
Posted on Saturday, 04 August, 2012 - 11:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Well, having sussed out why Echo (my 1984 Spirit) wouldn't idle, now I'm using the car pretty much every day it seems to me that I get jolted around in the car more than I used to. The rear suspension seems harder than it was. When I start the car, after a few seconds I can feel the back lifting, and I notice the nose drops a little - you can watch the Lady move down. I imagine this is perfectly normal? But does anyone have any ideas as to why the ride is harder than it was, please?

Stay well

Rod
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Daniel Diewerge
Experienced User
Username: didi13109

Post Number: 30
Registered: 11-2009
Posted on Sunday, 05 August, 2012 - 12:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello Rod, your rear gas speres are probably over their lifespan. A very easy and non expensive DIY repair. The rest of your suspension behavior seems to be perfectly normal.
Cheers Daniel
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Omar M. Shams
Prolific User
Username: omar

Post Number: 269
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Sunday, 05 August, 2012 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Daniel is spot on with his diagnosis.
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Roderick Waite
Frequent User
Username: rodwaite

Post Number: 55
Registered: 1-2012
Posted on Sunday, 05 August, 2012 - 04:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

That was quick, and thank you, Daniel and Omar! I imagine I'll need a 3 ton car lift or something, which I don't have, but a friend does! I shall beg a loan of it ... are the gas bottles standard Citroen parts? Can a Citroen main dealer do the job on a Rolls? I have one handy, and that would be the most elegant solution!

Stay well

Rod
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Omar M. Shams
Prolific User
Username: omar

Post Number: 270
Registered: 4-2009
Posted on Sunday, 05 August, 2012 - 05:13 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Dear Rod,
You will not need any jacks as the spheres are in the boot of your car (not underneath).
The spheres (or accumulators) look identical to the Citroen ones but their charge pressures are different. To use the wrong charge pressure will result in a ride that is not appropriate for the Rolls-Royce. These parts are cheap enough from Paul Yorke anyway. They are easy to replace - all you need to ensure is that you have depressurised the system before removing them. Most mechanics will not find it hard to replace these accumulators. You will need to bleed the system after replacement.
Thanks
Omar
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Roderick Waite
Frequent User
Username: rodwaite

Post Number: 56
Registered: 1-2012
Posted on Sunday, 05 August, 2012 - 07:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thanks Omar! Can't imagine where they are in the boot though! No doubt I'll be educating myself in the near future! With the spare wheel underneath, the fuel tank in front, and no room at the back or sides ... maybe they're a lot smaller than I imagine! I've e-mailed Paul Yorke (the one in Wales I guess?) so will soon find out all I need to know.

Thanks again and stay well ...

Rod
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Peter Talbot
Prolific User
Username: squerryes

Post Number: 126
Registered: 7-2010
Posted on Sunday, 05 August, 2012 - 08:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Rod

You forgot the front of the boot, i.e. the space between the front of the boot and the rear passenger seats

Looking from the rear of the opened boot towards the front of the car, there is the tool shelf covered by a pop studded lining flap then more boot lining below. Remove this and all will be reavealed - spheres are located lateraly on each side.
Agree with Omar : essential you depressurise first. Method for so doing is in the Workshop Manual.

Peter
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Bill Coburn
Moderator
Username: bill_coburn

Post Number: 1423
Registered: 4-2003
Posted on Sunday, 05 August, 2012 - 08:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Pity a bit of research through Tee One Topics hasn't been availed of! Have a look at rrtechnical.info our technical library find tee one topics, have a look at issue 24. There are at least another 9 references to your problem and how to fix it.
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Mark Herbstreit
Frequent User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 93
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Sunday, 05 August, 2012 - 11:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Also have a look at issue 12 of Crewe'd Jottings.
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Jan Forrest
Grand Master
Username: got_one

Post Number: 373
Registered: 1-2008
Posted on Monday, 06 August, 2012 - 10:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Frankly I would have suggested tired springs rather than the accumulators. I had much the same problem with The Old Girl a couple of years ago which was solved by fitting new coils. The need for the self levelling to activate every time the car has been stood for more than a couple of hours is the clue. In practice it's only there to allow for a couple of portly passengers and/or heavy lggage in the boot. Otherwise the rear of the car shouldn't droop at all. The accumulators are situated on top of the spring mounts for just this reason.

A simple test is to try and slide a flat hand over the top of the rear tyres without losing a knuckle on the arch. If you can't then the springs are becoming due for changing.
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Mark Herbstreit
Frequent User
Username: mark_herbstreit

Post Number: 94
Registered: 5-2005
Posted on Monday, 06 August, 2012 - 10:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Jan. You are comparing Shadows to Spirits. Apples and Oranges.
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Bill Coburn
Moderator
Username: bill_coburn

Post Number: 1424
Registered: 4-2003
Posted on Monday, 06 August, 2012 - 11:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Jan/ With respect, we are talking about an SZ car a Spirit, not a Shadow. The rear levelling system on the latter was originally selected to cope with the CV joints in the rear drive shafts. The addition of the brakes to the system apparently, I am told, followed.

The Shadow levelling is not really critical until the body really sinks to a very low level as happened to a local car with nil levelling. As you imply two fat arses in the back took the outer universals to the angular limit and any bumps caused a resounding series of thumps and vibration. This was the outer universals thumping over their natural stops. Properly adjusted and with good accumulator pressure (at least 1200 psi) the car will indeed compensate just with the driver getting in. I had the pleasure of pointing out to a cocksure chauffeur in a nearly new car in the mid seventies that when his esteemed rear seat passenger and his wife (both well fed examples) alighted in the port cochere, the rear end of the car assumed an erection at the rear that would have done a drag racer proud. The reason was that for this car the self levelling system solenoid was wired to the ignition switch which our haughty driver switched off as soon as he stopped. When the corpulants alighted the rams were probably fully extended and the springs assumed their design length. He actually deigned to listen to me and practised leaving the engine running with the transmission in Park while he did the opening door thing. Later cars switched the solenoid through the door switches and/or the gear selector motor.

All that said. the rear springs on a Spirit are a measure of last resort. My Spur happily subsides after about three days undisturbed but pumps up as soon as the accumulators at the engine end get enough pressure in them to lift the car which is done with the accumulators at the other end. As you will know, the Shadow has only one set of accumulators mounted on the side of the engine. When these are exhausted the car shouldn't sink, unless as is done, some wit has used the self levelling to compensate for sagged springs. That is why when you check one of these cars out, you pump down the accumulators until the lights come on and then some (hopefully the lights will come on) then roll the car back or forward a few feet then check if the car has sunk indicating a need for new springs. The rolling bit is to cancel the natural 'lift' effect through the rear wheel camber.
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Roderick Waite
Frequent User
Username: rodwaite

Post Number: 63
Registered: 1-2012
Posted on Thursday, 23 August, 2012 - 05:55 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

My thanks to everyone on this - found the gas spheres I prefer 'accumulators') exactly as advised. I bought both a rear pair and a front pair from Paul Yorke, who patiently explained why the fronts are called 'accumulators' while the almost identical rear ones are called 'Spheres'. While at it, both rocker cover gaskets were replaced as well - but because I'd used neoprene instead of cork, I had to replace the spacers and isolators as well.

But, she rides beautifully, and no more oil leaks either ... The Forum strikes again ... !

Rod

PS. I have also stopped the frightening screeches from the aircon drive belts by waving a tin of anti-slip at them ... most of it ended up everywhere else due to the fan blast though ...
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Michael Hicks
Frequent User
Username: bentleyman22

Post Number: 67
Registered: 12-2011
Posted on Friday, 24 August, 2012 - 05:05 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hi Can you tell me where my belt's are on my suspension i have spent a week looking for them

Moderator's Comment: have moved the "Squealers" to a topic of their own so your suspension can have our undivided attention!!
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Roderick Waite
Frequent User
Username: rodwaite

Post Number: 68
Registered: 1-2012
Posted on Friday, 24 August, 2012 - 07:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Te-he! Michael - I bet you can't find the spacers and isolators either ... sorry about that, I get carried away and there's so many things need fixing that one thing leads to another ...

Stay well

Rod

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