| Author | Message | ||
     Leo Stoffels Unregistered guest Posted From: 82.176.255.67 |
Hello, I build a brand new electronic ignition for the Shadow, Spirit, Spur and Bentley Derivatives. The ignition is almost ready but I need the ignition curve from the cars build from 1965 until the late ’80. When it’s completely finished I will write about it. But you can replace the complete old unit by the new one, and its “plug and play”. It is high-tech on the inside but looks “original” on the outside. All what I need is the ignition curve’s for the V8’s. I can not find them in the workshop manuals. Can somebody help me? Thanks Leo (Message approved by david_gore) | ||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 874 Registered: 4-2003 |
A curve for pre-emission specification Shadow V8 engines may be found on the following link: http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/963.html | ||
| leo Stoffels Yet to post message Username: leo Post Number: 1 Registered: 3-2009 |
Thanks David, that is what I'm looking for. Do you know if this is also curve for the later cars without emission control, shadow 2 spirit for example? Leo | ||
| David Gore Moderator Username: david_gore Post Number: 875 Registered: 4-2003 |
Hi Leo, Now you are opening a can of worms - the post 1973 cars fitted with emission controls varied in specification depending which part of the world they were destined for delivery and what enhancements were made over the years. I will have to defer here to others with greater knowledge and experience than I. | ||
| Richard Treacy Grand Master Username: richard_treacy Post Number: 1632 Registered: 4-2003 |
David - indeed. The curves were all in a special section of the Technical Library for a few months, but were lifted because there are too many variants. Needing the curves implies that the mechanical centrifugal and vacuum advance bits of the distributor are to be locked up, that an electronic induction depression transducer is to be introduced, and that a wholesale digital system is to be introduced instead. That goes even further than any other routine change on offer, and approaches the Bosch EZ 58F digital ignition of the 20,000-series Turbo Rs and of all 30,000-series SZ cars. I do feel that the best way to go is a Crane Cams insert for the Opus-equipped distributors before they pass out. To date, there seems to be none better available. As with all electronic bits, the electronic ignitions start to fail unexpectedly and completely after time, and the electronic ignitions of the mid-series Silver Shadows are ripe for retirement if they still survive. If you are lucky enough to have an earlier car with ignition points, gosh - leave them alone as they last forever. RT. | ||
| Richard Treacy Grand Master Username: richard_treacy Post Number: 1633 Registered: 4-2003 |
ps: if the centrifugal advance were to be deleted, then a special type of distributor cap and a wide-angle rotor arm would be required. None exist suitable for these cars. That is why the EZ 58F system has a twin 4-cylinder distributor with its time-wary toothed drive belt. An 8-cylinder cap cannot cope. Zytec cars have no distributor at all. | ||
| leo Stoffels New User Username: leo Post Number: 2 Registered: 3-2009 |
Thanks David and Richard, When I have the right curves for the cars the Igniton will be ready. The iginton doesn't need the ballast rissitor, the car will be running better. It also offers: - vacuum-advance - automatic dwell - spark balancing - automatic power-cut after 1 second Explanation of Spark Balancing: Spark Balancing is an advanced technology normally used in Formula 1, where engine speeds are tremendously high. This technique is built into the ignition. Its microprocessor constantly monitors the amount of energy contributed by each individual cylinder. Assume for example that the compression of one cylinder differs from the others. The motion of the flywheel would be less smooth, and so is the motion of the camshaft. The ignition detects this, and adjusts the timing of each cylinder individually. This results in a much quieter engine, more power and less wear. AUTOMATIC DWELL CONTROL: A mechanical distributor has a fixed dwell-angle, sometimes resulting in overheated coils at low speeds, weaker sparks and misfiring at high speeds. Why? An ignition coil only needs a couple of milliseconds to charge, but with a fixed dwell-angle these are ”overcharged” many times when idling, resulting in… overheated coils! At high speeds the fixed dwell angle tends to leave too little time to fully charge the coil, resulting in… weaker sparks and misfiring! The ignition measures the amount of current flowing into the coil, in such a way that the strongest possible spark is guaranteed at all engine-speeds, whilst keeping the coil cool. Also to prevent coil overheating, the power to the coil is cut-off as soon as the engine stops. An LED for easy static timing is integrated into the 123 ; the design is layed-out in such a way that the static timingmark ( at Top-Dead-Center) of the engine can be used. Leo | ||
| Richard Treacy Grand Master Username: richard_treacy Post Number: 1634 Registered: 4-2003 |
OK, I'll see if I can find an archive. Out of interest, are you doing all the advancing and retarding in software/firmware, the vacuum and turbo boost functions included ? I assume that the knock sensors, where fitted, are part of it too. RT. | ||
| Richard Treacy Grand Master Username: richard_treacy Post Number: 1636 Registered: 4-2003 |
Ah yes. The 123- You can see it on You Tube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1PFb46gKlc http://www.britishsportscars.nl/123%20ontsteking.htm | ||
| leo Stoffels New User Username: leo Post Number: 3 Registered: 3-2009 |
I developed it with the guys from 123 especially for the shadow and spirits with the ignitions points and opus ignition (we had a lot of problems with the opus ignition). At this moment I am testing it on a shadow (1978), and I must say it’s amazing! I hope that there will be some interest this ignition. It will be cheaper than a second hand opus ignition and much better and reliable. Leo | ||
| Patrick Lockyer. Grand Master Username: pat_lockyer Post Number: 809 Registered: 9-2004 |
Leo,others and I in the UK are still running the original Lucas Opus with redused air gap. No problems yet,but we are on borrowed time. Send me a private Email when you have sorted the product for sale. Are you able to market a universal 4 and 6 cylinder points conversion. Ok sorry just seen the link. Question on for and six cylinders answered. (Message edited by pat lockyer on 13 March 2009) | ||
| leo Stoffels New User Username: leo Post Number: 4 Registered: 3-2009 |
Thanks everyone for helping me. 25 ignitions have been produced. A number in the shadows and a number in the early spirits have been placed. The first results were better expected. Leo  |
