| Author | Message | ||
     Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 877 Registered: 5-2012 |
Hi Folks 74 SY1 - SRX18501 I'm in the process of fitting a temperature gauge, which necessitates the removal of the top roll. Whilst in there, I thought I'd repair my windscreen wipers, which do not park or run at fast speed (normal and intermittent are ok). I was wondering if anyone has a map of the components arrowed in the following photo. Is the small white box next to the three relays the famous buzzer?  As always, any help gratefully received. Geoff | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 1553 Registered: 6-2009 |
Geoff, Unless the SY1s are different, I have to believe that the yellowish plastic box next to your three relay cluster is the UD14927 Low Coolant Amplifier. In the SY2 cars there's another item that looks almost exactly like it that's related to the "Ice" light, which I don't think your car has. There should be a paper label on it somewhere. I could swear I used to know what those relays next to it are for, but I'm having trouble finding that info at the moment. If I come upon it I'll definitely post additional updates. Brian | ||
| Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 879 Registered: 5-2012 |
Brian Many thanks. I have trawled the manuals but cannot find any reference to these relays. I know one of them is related to the headlights and the other to the wipers as I can hear them click, however, even with touching them I cannot determine which one is actually clicking. I will, tomorrow, remove them and test them off the car and will be able to identify their functionality by observing which system doesn't work when a particular relay is removed. The reason I asked this question was just in case someone had already mapped these relays. Regards Geoff | ||
| Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 880 Registered: 5-2012 |
Brian BTW - you are correct, the SY1 does not have an ice light, however it does have the coolant amplifier and I am sure you have identified it correctly. The search is now on for the buzzer (assuming my car has one, as I have never heard it sound). Geoff | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 1556 Registered: 6-2009 |
Geoff, I can always hear a relay click around center dash when I turn the cruise control on/off and it sounds like there's another that's got something to do with the climate control and clicks as temperature in the cabin changes. I presume you're talking about the overheat buzzer, and I've never heard that sound, either. I know what the key buzzer looks like in SRH33576, but am not certain whether the overheat buzzer is in any way similar. If you've never seen my article on repairing the low coolant level amplifier take a quick look at the little test lamp I created from an extension cord, micro alligator clips, and a 12V mini lamp. This thing has been very handy for connecting on to specific relay terminals when the relays are partially pulled from their sockets (if they have them) or just clipped on to those that don't when I want to know when a given circuit is being completed. Brian | ||
| Bob Reynolds Grand Master Username: bobreynolds Post Number: 303 Registered: 8-2012 |
I started a topic for the whereabouts of all the various relays on the Shadow, which contains exactly this information. I investigated these relays some years ago. Here is the page: http://au.rrforums.net/cgi-bin/forum/discus.pl?pg=prev&topic=17001&page=15292 "I can identify the 3 relays in the centre of the dash, as I have had all that PCB out to trace the wiring. None of my warning lights worked at all, now they all work (smile). The 3 relays are, from the back: Warning Lamp Test Relay; Fuel Warning Dimmer Relay; Coolant Probe Relay. The circuit in the white plastic plug-in box is the Coolant Level Amplifier. (This became the Screenwash Amplifier in the Shadow 2). There are 2 spare relay positions, I think one is for the Ice warning. The Warning Lamp Test Relay is operated by the starter switch and puts Earths out (through diodes) to all the warning lamps to check the bulbs (Note that it ONLY checks the bulbs, not the wiring or sensors). The Fuel Warning Dimmer Relay is operated whenever the lights are on, and puts a 30 ohm resistor is series with the Fuel warning lamp. The resistor is underneath the PCB. The Coolant Probe Relay is operated by the Hot Metal Sensor, and also by the Warning Lamp Test Relay. It just disconnects the coolant probe from the circuit so that no coolant is detected. This has the effect of lighting the Colant Level lamp. " The relays and control boxes for the wipers are on another board, underneath that one. Quite difficult to get to. These are also documented on that other page. PS: I had a great deal of difficulty trying to find that old topic. I only found it because I remembered some obscure word on the page. Anybody searching for 'Relays' probably wouldn't have found it. What is the point in providing good solid reference information (often with great effort and time) only to have it disappear from the map? | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 1557 Registered: 6-2009 |
Bob, Not that it's much comfort to either of us, but there does appear to be some acknowledged "glitch" in the search feature and has been for some time. I've been every bit as frustrated as you are when trying to find certain material that I know is out there but using any of the keywords you'd expect would pull it up just simply doesn't work. I find it even weirder that you often, but not always, can dredge the stuff up if you remember some really "obscure word" and use it to search on instead. BTW, since I have 2 SY2 cars for comparison, that white plastic box remained the low coolant level amplifier and the other one is for the ice warning. I've never seen a screenwash level amplifier. I think the coolant level amplifier is only necessary because of the interesting method they used with regard to the probes. Brian | ||
| Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 882 Registered: 5-2012 |
Bob I really appreciate your finding the thread you have linked and also the information you have given in this thread. It already explains why I can hear the relay click when I operate the wipers but cannot feel which one - the relevant relays are buried underneath. When I have sorted the wipers on my car, fitted the temperature gauge but before I replace the top roll I intend mapping the relays on my car. The information you have given now makes this a simple documenting job. Thank you. Geoff | ||
| Chris Browne Prolific User Username: chrisb Post Number: 225 Registered: 2-2010 |
Hello all, Here are a couple of photos. The first shows details of the top roll relays and amplifiers. The second shows the location of the engine overheat buzzer which on a Shadow 2 is directly behind the speedometer. Perhaps it is in the same place on a Shadow 1? Not sure. Hope this helps.   Kind regards, Chris | ||
| Robert Noel Reddington Grand Master Username: bob_uk Post Number: 334 Registered: 5-2015 |
Smashing photos. Chris Browne Top photo bottom right scotch lock. Keep a wary eye on that scotch lock. | ||
| Chris Browne Prolific User Username: chrisb Post Number: 226 Registered: 2-2010 |
Well spotted Bob but thankfully not my car. It is taken from a cutaway Shadow which the RREC use as a demonstrator. Kind regards, Chris | ||
| Bob Reynolds Grand Master Username: bobreynolds Post Number: 304 Registered: 8-2012 |
That board must be from a Shadow 2, because it's completely different from a Shadow 1. What's that square contraption on the bottom right, with the red wire going to it? A heatsink? | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 1559 Registered: 6-2009 |
Chris, Thanks so very much for posting both of those photographs!! Bob, that's definitely the relay cluster that sits almost dead center under the top roll of an SY2 car. Although Chris's photographs are far superior, the one I took that's included in this article on refurbishing the low coolant amplifier gives a different perspective on the same thing. Brian | ||
| Geoff Wootton Grand Master Username: dounraey Post Number: 883 Registered: 5-2012 |
Hi Chris Thanks for the photos. I checked behind the speedometer on my SY1 but could not see the buzzer there. However, at least I now know what I'm looking for, assuming there is one on my car. Regards Geoff | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 1560 Registered: 6-2009 |
Geoff, Just FYI, this is precisely what the "key left in ignition" buzzer looks like in SRH33576. For all I know they could be one and the same and share functions. I ended up putting some electrical tape over mine because it was so loud and obnoxious. I can still hear it, but the sound is quite tolerable. I think mine was also relocated as part of the great RHD to LHD conversion. It will be interesting to see, if these things are two different items, whether my overheat buzzer is now behind my glovebox, which is near where the speedometer once was. Brian | ||
| Robert Noel Reddington Grand Master Username: bob_uk Post Number: 340 Registered: 5-2015 |
A bit of foam stuffed into buzzers usually attenuates the awful racket. Or a hammer. | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 2349 Registered: 6-2009 |
Hello All, I'm reviving this thread to see if one of our resident electronic engineers/experts can refresh my memory regarding the tech spec needed for the zener/breakdown diode for the coolant level amplifier. I know that one should select a breakdown voltage ranging that's 5V up through 6.8V, but does it matter if it's a 1W version, which would allow a 1N4733 (5.1V), 1N4734 (5.6V),1N4735 (6.2V), 1N4736 (6.8V), versus a 5W version, which would be the 1N5338B, 39B, 41B, & 42B - respectively for the same breakdown voltages. There are also 400mW and 500mW equivalents if you want to go down the power scale. (And probably lots more - I'm sticking with a website from which I've ordered these sorts of components before.) I simply cannot remember what I got from Radio Shack and made no notes regarding the power rating at all. It might make no difference at all in this application, but I know someone else will be able to fill in that blank. Brian | ||
| John Kilkenny Prolific User Username: john_kilkenny Post Number: 267 Registered: 6-2005 |
Brian, It's not critical. As long as the Zener voltage enables the first transistor to conduct for a loss of coolant condition, the indicator will come on. This transistor is a pre-amp so the power is low. A six volt 1 watt zener should be fine. | ||
| Brian Vogel Grand Master Username: guyslp Post Number: 2352 Registered: 6-2009 |
John, Thanks much! Brian | ||
| John Kilkenny Prolific User Username: john_kilkenny Post Number: 268 Registered: 6-2005 |
I forgot to include the circuit diagram  |
