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Joseph Carey
New User
Username: techy123

Post Number: 3
Registered: 08-2019
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 04:44:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Hello there everyone!

I'm a bit new here, so please correct me if I'm doing anything incorrectly here.

I have a 69' Silver Shadow RHD (unsure of exact chassis number but I do know it is pre 30,000).

I bought it recently and have been attempting to sort it.


As of now, it has no brakes, doesn't run... or drive, yay, I'm hoping that someone here can point me in the right direction towards solving some of these issues! Thank you all for taking the time to read and help me with this!




Here's the lowdown:

So, the vehicle was supposed to be a "run and drive" when purchased site unseen, however it does neither. Upon hooking up a battery, I am greeted with power to the dash, when the key is turned, a Gen light comes on and the fuel pump can be heard priming. (I'm pretty sure I have some stuck floats as the pump recently dumped fuel on the ground when we were testing earlier, an indication of some stuck or sunk floats, but that's beside the point).

When the key is turned to the Start position, nothing happens. No solenoids clicking, no sounds, nothing. Through some probing I found that no power was reaching the starter motor solenoid.

Furthering that issue, I found that no spark was present when the engine was in the ON position and the starter was shorted with a screwdriver (testing to see if starter was bad, or something else)


Now, I don't pretend to know much about these at all, I purchased this after some research but this is my first RR (I'm also only 19) so I don't know what exactly all of this means, however I have a hypothesis:

The shift lever can be heard shifting gears on the transmission when the car is in its on state, I can hear the servo working for R, N, D, I, and L, however there is no sound or apparent change from R up to P.

Like I said, this is but a hypothesis, but could not being in park be the reason my engine will A: not turn over when key is turned to START position, and B: has no spark when key is in the ON position?

Possibly a safety measure meant to make sure the car doesn't roll away while someone is starting it?

Additionally, I tested these same things with the vehicle in N with the same results. Nothing discernible could be seen as different. With that in mind, I took the plugs out, gapped them, and gave them a good cleaning as well as re-seated the distributor wires (it appears whoever was in there before me put new wires on the distributor but the "crimp-like" ends of the wires on the distributor side were not touching the pins on the top of the distributor (in other words, they were not making good electrical connections if any at all, which is very odd...). I then proceeded to crimp them down so that they fit snuggly onto the distributor cap.

Next, I took the distributor cap off and proceeded to clean the points, they opened and closed but seemed corroded, I sanded them down as well as the wiper arm and other contacts inside the cap including all applicable wires and terminals.

With that out of the way I went to the coil and proceeded to clean each of the wires and terminals on the coil to ensure there was good connection between all of them.

After cleaning and reattaching everything as it was, I was greeted to nothing having changed :-( no turning over upon key in START position, and no spark in ON position. (I made sure to check and clean the area where I was resting the sparkplugs to ensure that was not a problem either).



If not being in P was the problem, I'd be happy because that would make my life much easier. I plan on tearing into the servo soon, but I want to check with you as you seem to have alot more experience with this than I do. Are these symptoms something that could happen if the car wasn't in park? It seems like that could be a possibility.


Thank you for reading all of this!

Godspeed, and thank you for any help you can give :-)


Sincerely,

Joseph Carey






I'll update this with pictures whenever I can. I'm currently at university but I'll be going home this weekend and will attempt to work on the vehicle best I can then.
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Mike Thompson
Frequent User
Username: vroomrr

Post Number: 952
Registered: 04-2019
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 05:32:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I bought a 1975 Silver Shadow for $2500 USD. On mine I have had to reinvent the brakes, carb, and my electric linkage to the transmission was unhooked for some reason. See my posts:

Brake System Using Booster & Master Cylinder

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/35273.html?1560318898

#2 Brake System Using Booster & Master Cylinder

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/36679.html?1565540292

Hulking Edelbrock 4 Barrel Conversion

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/35239.html?1562600341

Help Restore My 1975 Silver Shadow

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/35587.html?1560318680

#2 Help Restore My 1975 Silver Shadow

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/36675.html?1565590387

1975 Silver Shadow How To Dismantle And Restore

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/35451.html?1564799711

Probably everything you are going to have to restore, on the cheap, is in there somewhere. But the electrics to the engine were fine on mine.
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Mike Thompson
Frequent User
Username: vroomrr

Post Number: 953
Registered: 04-2019
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 05:49:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Also Ronny Shaver AKA rollsroycenut has lots of videos

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtyT4vrt9MHU2foP_KTNJwg
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Geoff Wootton
Grand Master
Username: dounraey

Post Number: 2154
Registered: 05-2012
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 05:55:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Welcome to the group Joseph.

I did wonder why you didn't just try it in P until your last sentence when you explained you are at Uni and a distance away from your car.

You need the car to be in P or N for it to crank. Since you've tried it in N and there is no response you will need to do some fault finding this weekend.

In P or N you should get a voltage at the starter solenoid. I realize you got no voltage at the solenoid, but when you checked it is not clear you were in P or N. Check again in P, then work backwards. There is a starter relay immediately before the solenoid - check for voltage here when the key is fully turned. The relay is situated on the front bulkhead close to the accelerator linkage.

Let us know the VIN number. It is situated at the lower left corner of the windshield.
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Geoff Wootton
Grand Master
Username: dounraey

Post Number: 2155
Registered: 05-2012
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 06:01:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Since you are new to RR ownership you may not be aware that you can download free copies of the workshop manuals:

http://rrtechnical.info/

These are supplied courtesy of the Australian Rolls Royce Owners Club.
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ross kowalski
Prolific User
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 1229
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 07:02:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Joseph,

1. You won't have much braking without the engine running on this car. I would get the engine running first. It's kind of a long story, but unlike most cars, you really want the engine running on a shadow before doing the brakes.

So you have a no crank no spark at least so that is where I would go first.

After checking all the fuses, look at Geoff's link and find your wiring diagram (s) trace the wire from the starter solenoid back to the ignition switch and check out the wire colors. A test light should tell you where that path is broken.

As for the no spark there are a lot of little "could bes" there that are easily figured out but get the car cranking as it makes testing for spark a lot easier.

Were it my car Id hit the following items in the following order.

1. Get the key cranking the car
2. Get the candles sparking
3. Get the fuel flowing
4. Get the brakes stopping.
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Joseph Carey
New User
Username: techy123

Post Number: 4
Registered: 08-2019
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 08:10:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thank you all for the replies!

I look forward to trying what you've all said.

To clarify on what I said earlier. The transmission makes no sound like gears changing to PARK, I put the lever into park when possible but it wasn't clear if it was in park. This would probably be the reason.

N was the next best bet as I was able to count the gear changes and select N. This was also the gear it was in when it was delivered to me.

I really wish I could dig into the car now but I won't be able to until Saturday or so.



Another question i have @Ross_Kowalski & @Geoff Wooton

How do I access the Transmission Servo to check those contacts? I imagine I'd have to under the belly of the beast? I'll checkout the workshop manuals in the meantime.


Thank you all for your support! I hope by this weekend I'll have a running car!

@Ross Kowalski as for the brakes. When the car was delivered it was said to have "No brakes" and indeed that was the case as I held on in the drivers seat as it "rolled" off the trailer with me frantically trying the already to the floor pedal.

My brake resivour has lots of fluid in the right compartment, not much in the left compartment as can be seen through the sight glass.

Upon pulling the brake pedal up with my hand (so it is not resting on the floor) and pushing it, I can hear a *squelch* noise. This was good news as I was afraid everything was seized or something.

Next though, I saw fluid pouring out of the location I highlighted on the picture I attached (I think. Hard to tell as I was just trying to clean it up (originally thinking it was gas, but then smelling and feeling it had me discern that it was in-fact my precious RR363 brake fluid!
hydraulic diagram with annotation of leaking area


I'll get under the car sooner or later as I now found a place I can work on her.



The VIN of the vehicle is as follows: SRH7321



Thanks!

- Joseph
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Mike Thompson
Frequent User
Username: vroomrr

Post Number: 955
Registered: 04-2019
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 09:12:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

If your parking brakes are working, they will stop you if you are going slow enough, I did it to get it into the garage.

The leak is likely coming from the rat trap, where there is a nightmare of tubing. Depending on how long the car sat, and if the previous owners took care of the car; if you have to start replacing parts or rebuilding parts, it could cost more than the car (as in my case).

As said, unless the engine is running you will not have brakes, the brakes are worked by pumps on the engine. And there is what is called here, Yak to replace the RR363. Brakes are unbelievably complex on RRs.

Another link, example:

https://www.rrsilvershadow.com/ETechn/Hydr/Compmstr.htm

Menu

https://www.rrsilvershadow.com/ETechn/Hydr/Menurem.htm
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Brian Vogel
Grand Master
Username: guyslp

Post Number: 2966
Registered: 06-2009
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 09:36:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

If anyone needs the whole Workshop Manual for the SY1 (Shadow "One" & Derivatives) series cars, you can download it as a ZIP file here:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=11xZS249vU7Gke4442smqDrkRNevUZ398

or the SY2 (Shadow II and Derivatives) series cars, here:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1-6hyr0NB1Aoccpej6oEvmo4i2WbZUH_l


All thanks to the RROC Australia. It just so happens that I pulled all of the various chapters together into one ZIP file and OCR processed them beforehand.

Brian
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Larry Kavanagh
Frequent User
Username: shadow_11

Post Number: 496
Registered: 05-2016
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 11:01:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Starter motor relay may be faulty or have corroded contacts. Also, wiring to starter motor solenoid and between solenoid and motor may have corroded contacts. If working on the starter motor or solenoid contacts first disconnect the earth cable at the battery.
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ross kowalski
Prolific User
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 1230
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 12:46:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Joseph,

I just pulled the book which I find more useful in that the diagrams are not split up as they are in the pdf files.

Looks like the starting circuit goes like this ignition switch > neutral safety switch > starter relay > starter.

With the wiring diagram and a test light you should be able track this down. Pretty much it's follow the electrons until they stop.

This would be tons easier with a buddy to turn the key to crank as you test things
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Trevor Hodgekinson
Experienced User
Username: wm20

Post Number: 61
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 15:22:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Or pull the ignition switch and jump the connection battery to starter
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Mike Thompson
Frequent User
Username: vroomrr

Post Number: 957
Registered: 04-2019
Posted on Tuesday, 10 September, 2019 - 18:19:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

If you are going that route of hot wiring. All you need is a wire from the battery to the + side of the coil, then a jumper cable or big wire to the starter solenoid. If you don't have spark then it is probably the coil.
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Joseph Carey
New User
Username: techy123

Post Number: 5
Registered: 08-2019
Posted on Thursday, 12 September, 2019 - 00:20:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

@Mike Thompson, I was going to attempt to, but I haven't had much experience with coils and so I was a little bit hesitant as to how to go about jumping that as there were a few wires running to terminals on the coil and I was unable to (in my brief look) locate a schematic or picture of the coil specifically and how that is wired. I'm planning on taking a more in-depth look at the manuals and schematics before I see the car Saturday.
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Mark Aldridge
Frequent User
Username: mark_aldridge

Post Number: 641
Registered: 10-2008
Posted on Thursday, 12 September, 2019 - 01:40:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Is it a ballasted coil at this chassis number ?

Safety : Ensure gearbox is in Park before attempting to hotwire preferably with the gearshift otter switch removed !!
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Mike Thompson
Frequent User
Username: vroomrr

Post Number: 960
Registered: 04-2019
Posted on Thursday, 12 September, 2019 - 03:22:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

I cannot guarantee this wiring is the same as your's because I have what I call a "tweener". It is a 1975 Shadow so it can have any parts from a Shadow I or Shadow II. Also it has a racing coil not the original coil. But + is white and light blue and - is white and a black strip on mine.

coil 1

coil 2

My carb

carb

My brakes

brakes

To ensure safety you can unhook the shifter bar from the electric actuator, at the front of the transmission, and move it to Park (someone here may say which direction that is, I forgot).
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Mike Thompson
Frequent User
Username: vroomrr

Post Number: 961
Registered: 04-2019
Posted on Thursday, 12 September, 2019 - 03:53:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Unhook bar at the front of the transmission, twist the lever to Park. (See above coil.)

bar
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Robert J. Sprauer
Frequent User
Username: wraithman

Post Number: 540
Registered: 11-2017
Posted on Thursday, 12 September, 2019 - 04:21:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

The small lever on the transmission, when in park is forward, followed by R, N, etc.
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ross kowalski
Prolific User
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 1232
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Thursday, 12 September, 2019 - 11:39:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Joseph,

Here's a video.
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Joseph Carey
New User
Username: techy123

Post Number: 6
Registered: 08-2019
Posted on Friday, 13 September, 2019 - 02:00:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

@Ross Kowalski

Wow! this goes above and beyond. Thank you so much for that video. I'll make sure to document my process as well and post it here soon.

You guys are really a great group. Getting into this I was pretty hesitant as I didn't know if there was going to be anyone out there to help, but clearly I was incorrect.

Can't wait to get started on this. I have help from about 6 people coming with me so we should be able to get alot done Saturday.


Once again, Thank you @Ross for your dedication to making that video for me, greatly appreciated. Wish there was a way I could pay that back to you, hopefully knowing what a big help that's going to be is enough! :-)


Thank you all again! I'm excited and ready to jump into getting her working! I'll post about my exploits.
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Trevor Hodgekinson
Experienced User
Username: wm20

Post Number: 62
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Friday, 13 September, 2019 - 07:31:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Have not been following this thread as closely as I should have but you might have some funny wiring.
We bought a 4 speed car that will only crank if the left parkers are on.
A latter 3 speeder had a similar "anti thieft" wiring done so it would only crank if one of the interior lights were on, can't remember which lights for that one.
Now perhaps this was done by the local distributors York Motors cause we are all criminals down here .
This was a big problem because the casual drivers regularly forgot so if they were doing a one car wedding they would crank till the battery went flat.
So you might need to pull the dash if there is no power to the solenoid trigger wire before the switch.
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ross kowalski
Prolific User
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 1233
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Friday, 13 September, 2019 - 09:12:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Joseph,

If you make a list of what you'd like to accomplish this weekend I'm sure you would get good input as to the supplies you should bring along.

Don't forget to post a picture of your car and the serial number.

Luck.
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John Kilkenny
Frequent User
Username: john_kilkenny

Post Number: 315
Registered: 06-2005
Posted on Friday, 13 September, 2019 - 23:09:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Early Shadows had a Parking Lamp Switch to select either side parking lights, to reduce the load on the battery when night parking. The switch is normally in the centre position which selects both sides.
Cranking is prevented when the switch is not in the centre position.
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Joseph Carey
New User
Username: techy123

Post Number: 7
Registered: 08-2019
Posted on Saturday, 14 September, 2019 - 01:12:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

John, that's a very important distinction to know, thank you!

@Ross I plan to do as follows this weekend:
I have 6 friends coming to work on the car with me so hopefully we will be able to get alot done.


- Put car on jackstands and manually move transmission to park (in a safe manor on flat ground)

- Try starting the vehicle with headlight switch in the center facing up.

- Test the brakes as brake fluid was believed to have squirted out (engine was not running at the time) so maybe some valve wasn't working properly? Will have to test once engine is running.

- Next would be the Parking brake, it can be pulled without any sign of resistance and seems to not be connected via the cable (the yellow parking brake light comes on though, there is a cable hanging down below the vehicle so I'm pretty sure that has something to do with it (hanging down really low, not dragging, will have to inspect it when i'm under there)

- If mechanically sound, the plan is to begin moving on to the interior and begin removing what is left (the previous owner removed carpeting and such) to access the floor pans which have rusted through in some spots and begin surveying the floor and pans to determine what else should be done.

After this, I'm not sure I'd have much time to do anything else.

Assuming (I'm praying here) that we can get the engine running, and the brakes miraculously don't need attention, I'd like to move on to making lists of whats needed in terms of for it to drive and such.

I have starting fluid, 10gal of gas (extra just in case), absorbent for if i leak fluids, extra RR363, jackstands, (tools are on site), extra oil, fuel line, jumpers, battery charger/jumper pack.

Am I missing anything?

Also, here are some pictures of the car from when I bought it. I have some pics, but they're on a gopro with some other footage of me receiving the vehicle. I plan on making a video of everything as soon as I can.

For now, I have an album linked in onedrive here for your viewing. These are pics taken by Copart (a salvage auction company) on their lot in Boston, date and time of these pics are unknown. my bet is probably 3+ months have gone by if not longer since it was photographed for sale: https://1drv.ms/u/s!AsO2sv5LFau2gqF4PDCQONcR7dEzuA?e=z1vqbj

I'll upload my own pictures once I get a few more on my phone this weekend. I don't have the serial number of the vehicle, I have the VIN though, I will photograph the ID plates and serial number plates this weekend.

Please let me know if there's anything else I forgot, there are many details I didn't elaborate on, such as checking the pins on the column shifter and servo, which we will do when we're moving the transmission to park. (in short, the list I mentioned above is abreviated)


Cheers,

Joseph
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Robert J. Sprauer
Frequent User
Username: wraithman

Post Number: 541
Registered: 11-2017
Posted on Saturday, 14 September, 2019 - 02:34:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Starting fluid is highly NOT recommended. It has known to blow holes thru the dome of pistons with continued useage. Do you know where to jack up the car? The workshop manual shows you where. There may be spots that look like they may work and in reality if used will do alot of damage under the car. Check the manual before you proceed.
If the car has been sitting for a long time the brakes/hydraulics will certainly have to be addressed. To the beginner it can be overwhelming and expensive.
PS check Youtube under "wraithman" I have a video showing where to lift the car
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Joseph Carey
New User
Username: techy123

Post Number: 8
Registered: 08-2019
Posted on Saturday, 14 September, 2019 - 06:32:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Thank you for that clarification Robert, from working on some other cars that's definitely been a tool ive used before, but it seems to me that this is no ordinary vehicle we're talking about.

The jack points mentioned in your video are very helpful, I planned on using a floor jack and jackstands so this will work well for my purposes.
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ross kowalski
Prolific User
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 1234
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Saturday, 14 September, 2019 - 07:17:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Joseph,

I always bring a fire extinguisher. I do this Automatically because I keep fire extinguishers in everything but the bikes.

seriously, bring fire extinguisher.
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Trevor Hodgekinson
Experienced User
Username: wm20

Post Number: 64
Registered: 11-2006
Posted on Saturday, 14 September, 2019 - 08:54:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Double up on the starting fluid.
It is designed for diesls engines.
Strongly suggest you swap the starting fluid for carb cleaner.
Carb cleaner is also a lot more volatile than petrol but far less likely to pre-ignite and blow holes in pistons.
Although to be honest can't see a genuine RR piston doing that and as for breaking cranks, also highly unlikely.
These is a formula for making RR363 on one of the Citreon web sites .There is a link on this forum somewhere.
When we were running 8 cars we used a lot of fluid and putting a car back on the road is likely to burn through gallons of it.
All of the hoses will need to be replaced.
Big warning on the rubber lines to the front brakes.
These get soft & sticky inside so if you get the brake pumps working 2000 psi of fluid forces the lines open to apply the brakes, but there is nothing to release them.
We suffered this a few times till we understood that brake fluid definately needed to be replaced every 3 to 4 years.
Should your brakes jamb on, just release the pressure by loosening the bleed valves. remember there are 4 of them.
The Bentley I intend to put back on the road also has this problem so I just use the hand brake for now while shifting it around the yard
We found this out the very expensive way when smoke started billowing out from behind the wheels.
A new pair of rotors were not cheap even when uncle Tom generously gave us trade price on them.
After running the cars for 11 years there is nothing particularly difficult about maintenance & repair, just a lot of it.

When trying to crank the engine beware of voltage drop.
We had both points & EI cars.
The points cars would fire as the engine cranked where as the EI cars rarely fired till the starter motor stopped being energized
so it was crank for 30 second then release the key and the cars started every time.
Now this could have just been dirty connections some where but the only EI car that started while being cranked was the one with the geared truck starter.
If the car has the original points & condenser fuel pump better than average chance you will need to clean the points.
Any car with one that was left for 6 months or better needed to have the points cleaned.
When you turn the ignition on you should hear the pump ticking for a minute or two till the fuel system is at working pressure.
If it does not stop then either there is a leak or the diaphragm in the pump is gone.
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Mike Thompson
Frequent User
Username: vroomrr

Post Number: 967
Registered: 04-2019
Posted on Saturday, 14 September, 2019 - 10:41:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

From the pictures it looks like you have a long road ahead, like mine.

In my thread below I show how I used a home sewing machine and vinyl to restore the seats and make carpet.

1975 Silver Shadow How To Dismantle And Restore

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/35451.html?1564799711

On RR Shadows the park brake was designed incorrectly to fix it see my post:

Posted on Friday, 19 April, 2019 - 10:37:

Help Restore My 1975 Silver Shadow

http://au.rrforums.net/forum/messages/17001/35587.html?1560318680
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ross kowalski
Prolific User
Username: cdfpw

Post Number: 1235
Registered: 11-2015
Posted on Saturday, 14 September, 2019 - 12:21:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Joseph,

That color scheme really looks good on the car.
Can't wait to see it run.
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Alan Dibley
Frequent User
Username: alsdibley

Post Number: 211
Registered: 10-2009
Posted on Saturday, 14 September, 2019 - 18:12:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Footnote to the handbrake cable:-

I have seen a Shadow with the cable burned through by contacting the live post near the point where it makes the first right-angle turn round a pulley. A few hundred amps from the battery blows it apart in a second.

Inspect the end of the cable - if it looks as if it has melted the return springs are not pulling the cable enough to keep it tight. So check the rear cables before risking a repeat. Replacing the front cable is difficult, replacing it again is twice as difficult. How do I know????

This was a right-hand drive car. If the arrangement on a left-hand drive car is very different you have just wasted 30 precious seconds while reading this.

Alan D.
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Patrick Francis
Frequent User
Username: jackpot

Post Number: 293
Registered: 11-2016
Posted on Tuesday, 17 September, 2019 - 09:28:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

Joseph and crew,
Great to hear such enthusiasm. Getting the old girl up and running is going to be a herculean task, but keep at it. There will definitely not be any financial gain at the end of the road, but the sense of achievement can't be bought.
Keep strong, keep focussed and keep at it. Get through the troughs ( there will be a few!). When you feel like giving up, just walk away for a while, until the enthusiasm rekindles.
Good luck. You could not have chosen better than RROC Australia to guide you - believe me , I know!
Cheers
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Graham Phillips
Experienced User
Username: playtime

Post Number: 160
Registered: 03-2019
Posted on Monday, 07 October, 2019 - 13:44:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IP

G'day everyone,....


Just read this thread:

"what Patrick said!"


Graham.

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